ASCII download 1-Aug-1997 12:41p 컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� *** {Phoenix Project BBS Message Base File 2 of 3} *** ______________________________________________________________________________ Copyright (C) 1993 LOD Communications. No part of this Work may be distributed or reproduced, electronically or otherwise, in part or in whole, without express written permission from LOD Communications ______________________________________________________________________________ *** {General Sub-Board} *** < Q-scan General Discussion 1 - 132 msgs > 1/132: This Sub > Permanent Message Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sun Jan 07 05:09:24 1990 This subboard is for general b.s. - you can talk about anything from who just got busted to sports to the headlines. This is also the proper place to plug other BBSes. Anything even mildly technical probably has its own subboard. You can get a list of subs by typing "*" and you can change subs at the main prompt by simply typing the number of the subboard you wish to go to. Mentor 2/132: Welcome Back Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Jan 09 13:05:05 1990 Welcome back to Phoenix! Not everything is back together -- the transfer section, in particular, still needs some work. But I've started contacting our former users, and hope to have things back up to the normal speed by mid-February. Please advertise! Let everyone know that we're back! The Mentor Legion of Doom! 3/132: ... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 09 13:47:47 1990 MAN...Ok, first off, everyone try REAL hard to get their messages right the first time...the edit commands are terrible... NOW: I heard that Continental airlines has some kind of Super-super saver fare in which you can fly one way anywhere for 9 bucks...Amazing? Yeah I thought so...so if that's the real story, there is no excuse for you people who have said time and time again that you'd like to go to TX to not actually come...(Ahem...DAN!). So, in any event, welcome to the bbs...I'm damn glad it's local! ->ME .s 4/132: One way to Houston... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Tue Jan 09 18:18:20 1990 what a trip! $9 to Houston, $19 to Dallas I think.. not bad Daneel (Get it right the first time Erik) 5/132: airplanes Name: Silencer #31 Date: Sat Jan 13 02:16:40 1990 Really? where'd you here that? A comercial or what...if its true it looks like I'm headed towards LA next week....heheh......Also..one big greet to everyone new and old..... - Silencer/ DFKN 6/132: Well... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Sat Jan 13 10:02:07 1990 I was kind of wrong... I read the ocntinental ad in the paper yesterday... It seems that this is some kind of Texas thing, you can fly all over texas, and to OK City, and to New Orleans for no more then $38 one way...I might go to New Orleans... Hell for $38...I spend more than that on beer every night it seems... ->ME 7/132: Morris update Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sat Jan 13 12:54:00 1990 AM-HackersTrial 01-11 0370 ^AM-Hackers Trial,0381< Hackers Charged with Selling Computer Codes to Soviets on Trial< CELLE, West Germany (AP) _ Three West Germans ``hackers'' went on trial Thursday charged with selling Western military computer passwords and codes to the Soviets. Dirk Brzesinski, Peter Carl and Markus Hess were arrested last March after an investigation by U.S. and West German officials revealed they had obtained information giving them access to key military and research computers in the United States, Western Europe and Japan. A fourth man, 30-year-old Karl Koch, who was also arrested in the case, committed suicide in May. Brzesinski, 30, a computer specialist, told the court that Koch had come up with the idea of selling the information. ``We decided in 1986 to sell the information to the Soviets for 1 million marks ($605,000) to help them even out the technical know-how advantage of the West,'' Brzesinski said. Carl, 35, said he was responsible for contacting the Soviet trade mission in East Berlin, where he dealt with a contact identified only as ``Serge.'' Carl said he did not want to reveal anything more about the Soviets in court for fear of reprisals. Court records show Carl made at least 25 contacts with the Soviets and received a total of 90,000 marks ($54,500) for the information. According to Brzesinski, Koch before his death claimed he had managed to gain access to the U.S. Defense Department general databank known as Optimus. After the arrests last year, U.S. and West German news media reported that other computers the hackers entered included a NASA and a ``Star Wars'' research computer, as well as computers linked to nuclear weapons and energy research in Los Alamos, N.M., and the Fermi Laboratory in Illinois. However, U.S. officials said last year that although the hackers obtained sensitive codes and passwords to enter the computers, they were stopped short of obtaining any highly classified information. Investigators have said that codes and passwords from computers in Japan, Britain, France, Italy, Switzerland and West Germany were also obtained and sold to the Soviets. A verdict in the trial, scheduled to be completed in 12 sessions, is expected Feb. 8. The men face up to 15 years in prison each if convicted. AP-NR-01-11-90 2317EST< 8/132: Morris update Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sat Jan 13 12:56:35 1990 AM-ComputerWorm 01-11 0504 AM-Computer Worm,0518< Berkeley Programmer Says Worm Hid Itself From Victims< By WILLIAM KATES= Associated Press Writer= SYRACUSE, N.Y. (AP) _ The ``worm'' program that paralyzed a nationwide computer network in November 1988 was designed so its victims wouldn't know how they were being attacked, a computer expert testified Thursday. Robert T. Morris' rogue program used several methods to worm its way into the Internet network, said Keith Bostic, a program analyst at the University of California at Berkeley. ``It was designed to break into as many computer systems as quickly as possible and escape detection as it was doing so,'' Bostic said on the second day of testimony in Morris' computer tampering trial in U.S. District Court. Morris, 25, of Arnold, Md., is charged under the 1986 Computer Fraud and Abuse Act with ``hacking'' into a federal computer network. If convicted, he faces as many as five years in prison and a $250,000 fine. Prosecutors allege he devised and unleashed a program that replicated wildly, immobilizing an estimated 6,000 computers linked to Internet, including those at NASA and several Air Force installations and universities. Defense attorney Thomas Guidoboni has said that Morris created the worm as a computer security experiment, but that he made a programming mistake that let the worm go berserk. Guidoboni said during opening statements that once Morris learned of the problems his program was causing, he tried to stop it, and when that failed, he tried to alert network users. But Bostic testified that no one in Berkeley's computer science research group received any warning about the worm from Morris. Four top computer programmers worked 16 hours to crack the worm's defenses, he said. According to Bostic, the worm entered the school's computer system by using two defects in the software used by the system and by solving passwords, either through a list built into the worm or by checking possible guesses against the computer's own internal dictionary. The worm also took advantage of the computers' ``trust'' for one another on the same system, a process by which a second computer will allow access to the system after seeing that an account already has been authorized by another computer on that system, Bostic said. The rogue program hid itself in four ways, he told jurors. It traveled via binary code, rather than a more easily read source code, and those parts of the program that could be read by a literate user were encrypted to further mask what the worm was doing, Bostic said. Morris' program also was set up so that it provided phony identification names when Berkeley's scientists were trying to trace it. The worm created more deception by periodically changing the program identification number attached to it by the Berkeley computer system, he testified. Bostic said the ``quick and powerful attack'' by the worm left no computer on the university system untouched. ``It would break into as many machines as it could, even machines it could not run on. It was completely indiscriminate,'' Bostic said. AP-NR-01-11-90 2112EST< 9/132: Morris Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sat Jan 13 15:19:46 1990 So, how many of you think Morris will go to jail over this? How many think he'll get anything but community service? Mentor 10/132: Another update.... the case continues.... Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sun Jan 14 08:06:59 1990 SYRACUSE, N.Y. (UPI) -- A graduate student said Friday it was ``pretty amazing'' to watch classmate Robert Morris break into a computer at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology with a program that could land the computer whiz in jail. Dawson Dean III testified that five days before Morris allegedly unleashed a destructive program called a ``worm,'' he showed Dean he could enter an MIT computer without the machine acknowledging the intrusion. ``The machine didn't know that he was logged in,'' said Dean, an MIT graduate and doctoral candidate at Cornell Univesity. ``It was pretty amazing.'' Morris, 25, of Arnold, Md., is the first person to be prosecuted under a portion of the 1986 Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. He was indicted in July on a charge of causing financial loss by intentionally introducing a program into a military and research computer network without authorization. If convicted, he faces up to five years in prison and a $250,000 fine. Dean said the incident on Oct. 28, 1988, was preceeded by Morris allowing him to look over his shoulder at a computer terminal on Cornell's Ithaca, N.Y., campus and scan a list of more than 400 passwords Morris had discovered. The passwords had been translated from an ``encrypted,'' or coded, form into English. ``There are 4,096 ways to encrypt a given password,'' Dean said. ``He said he had done it basically to see if it was possible to do.'' Dean said Morris gave him the ``impression'' a computer at Cornell spent four days running a program the defendant had designed to find the true spelling of the encrypted passwords. ``I asked him, `Is mine in the list?''' Dean said. ``I also asked him if the password of this other really obnoxious graduate student was (listed).'' Dean confirmed for Justice Department trial lawyer Ellen Meltzer the list he read that night was similar to one investigators found in computer files Morris maintained at Cornell. Dean testified Morris told him he would pursue a doctorate and career in computer languages and, although he already had extensive experience in computer security, did not plan to write his thesis on security issues. ``He told me he had hacked around with computers before,'' Dean said. Under cross examination from defense attorney David O'Brien, Dean said he thought the suspect's efforts to break computer security systems was the result of an inquisitive mind. ``He was a graduate student of computer science. You're learning to do research. It's a real natural instinct to want to learn how the thing works,'' Dean said. Earlier, William Johnston, a computer systems manager at the Lawrence Berkely Laboratory in California, said the worm did not at any time endanger cancer patients at the research center, but cost the lab in excess of $10,000 to purge the system. Morris was a 1988 Harvard University graduate attending his first semester of graduate school when, prosecuters argue, his program replicated out of control Nov. 2, 1988, and froze about 6,000 computers linked to the major military and research computer networks Internet and Arpanet. A Cornell investigation found Morris, who has been suspended from the university until September, worked alone on the program, which it termed a ``juvenile act that ignored the clear potential consequences.'' 11/132: The question is... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Sun Jan 14 19:19:12 1990 how many think he should go to jail... and for how long? Daneel 12/132: long enough Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 14 21:38:38 1990 I think people who write viruses shouldn't be allowed to go free. This is a personal opinion, but mistakes do happen as you saw with that internet virus. I know that I would be highly pissed if the net went down under me. grey owl 13/132: well... Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 15 01:31:30 1990 I dunno, I think he'll get hit with about 750 hours of community service and maybe a hefty fine ($100,000 or so...) I doubt he'll do any time. Mentor 14/132: well Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 15 02:15:43 1990 Umm.. i dont disagree with the theory o viruses... what i do disagree wit is viruses which destroy systems. I a virus has a speciic task.. then by all means... go or it...but viruses which are deigned to destroy.. well.. only in the most dire o circumstances.. and even then.. Phoenix Jacking Out.. 15/132: Well... Name: Konica #47 Date: Mon Jan 15 15:57:50 1990 I know a guy that writes viruses all day on anyhing he possibly can to destroy a system. So when I get into anything I never trust him with anything. .s /e 16/132: Yeah... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 15 17:23:21 1990 Poor Mr. Morris...rough having to live under Dad's shadow... hell, if the damn thing would have just worm-ed around like he had wanted...it would have been beautiful. Unfortunately, it had a minor flaw and caused the problems it did. What exactly did it overwrite? Portions of sendmail or something? I don't remember. Yo: Loyd, maybe you or I should type up that Communications & the ACM article on the whole episode. I thought it was really cool, and a lot of people on here probably haven't ever read it. ->ME 17/132: hmm.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 15 17:48:44 1990 did morris ind the bug in sendmail himsel, or did he read it somewhere... and has anyone ever tried using that bug 18/132: right Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Jan 15 18:01:53 1990 I don't like viruses at all...just because of those unlikely mishaps that happened with the internet worm. It's just too risky. Either that or Morris wasn't careful enough. grey owl 19/132: worm Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 15 21:32:44 1990 Well, it wasn't the overwriting that caused a problem. He put a mechanism in it that "queried" a target system - if the worm was already installed, it would ignore the system. But he decided that this would be an easy way to defeat it, so set the thing to go ahead and re-install on about 1 in 1000 systems. He figured this would hit a couple a day - it turned out that it could be several hundred per hour. This clogged up the internet lines and slowed things down massively. (Yes, there were other symptoms - but this is the most obvious.) There are a couple of people on here who are testifying at that trial. We'll have to ask them for a summary once they're done. (Yes, I know they can't talk about it until it's over.) Mentor 20/132: transfer section! Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 15 22:27:44 1990 Ok, I've gotten a bunch of stuff uploaded to the transfer section. If anyone has issues #1-21 of Phrack already broken up into separate files (anyone who was on the original Phoenix may have d/l'ed them from here, even), please upload them. I don't want to go through the hassle of splitting them up again. When you are uploading files, unless you are in a specific computer section (i.e. Apple, IBM, etc.), please use a standard ARC program (not ZIP or PAK or LZH!). This way, most people can download them. I'll try to have the gfiles up within a week - but they're a significant pain in the butt. Mentor 21/132: ... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Mon Jan 15 22:40:45 1990 Yeah great. L{ts keep the UPLOADS{Coming in.i] Darn Line Noise. hehehe Tak/Scan Sysopf Of the Fourth Dimension The 4th Dimension! 619-745-1xxx. Login PW-SPECTRUM. Newuser PW-Gunship. 22/132: Worm, et al. Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Tue Jan 16 06:54:56 1990 For those of you who are on the internet, read comp.docs and get rfc1135. This is yet another article on the worm. It summarizes/reviews all previously written worm articles (i.e., Eugene Spaffords, etc.), explains in lay terms what actually happened (how the sendmail and fingerd holes worked and were exploited). It also has a very complete and very lengthy bibliography for anyon e interested in reading up on the worm. 23/132: Bug Name: Phase Jitter #3 Date: Tue Jan 16 09:42:12 1990 The sendmail bug, I'm quite sure, was just the sendmail -bs WIZ bug.. That's been around forever! 24/132: phracks... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Tue Jan 16 13:29:27 1990 Sure.... I'll upload 'em tonite. DS 25/132: sendmail bug Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Wed Jan 17 19:58:46 1990 Phase... if you're talking about the sendmail bug "that been around forwever", I assume you're talking about the hole in the bsd versions 2 and 4 sendmail. Actually, it's not really a hole. Basically, it reads in 256 (?) bytes for and address. However, if you send 256 bytes of garbage, any other information flows over into the receiveing system (like worm source instructions, etc). 26/132: well Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Thu Jan 18 01:54:17 1990 and does it still work ? 27/132: phracks Name: Silencer #31 Date: Thu Jan 18 05:26:55 1990 Well...if you want em....and no one gets em....I think most of that stuff (including the LOD tech journals and all that kinda stuff) can be found on Atlantis. am having trouble d/ling from there or I;d get em for ya. 28/132: Sorry for delaying... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Thu Jan 18 12:29:23 1990 I'll post 'em (Mentor gave 'em to me about 1 year ago)... I was just waiting to know how he wants 'em uploaded. BTW, Mentor, Someone fixed phrack 9 so, that wont be corrupted, but 2 issues ARE still missing. DS 29/132: ..... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Fri Jan 19 20:51:12 1990 ATTN- NAME- The Fourth Dimension Underground Number- 619-745-1xxx Login: SPECTRUM NEW USER PW: GUNSHIP 90 Megz! 100% Amiga FILES! Brand NEW BBS! growing fast alot of Expert conversations \\on the hour! Call now.. Tak/Scan TFD/PPP! 30/132: Arc Name: Johnny Hicap #45 Date: Fri Jan 19 21:56:04 1990 Does anyone have a Commodore 64 arc program? If so, can you upload it for me.... 31/132: phrack... Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sat Jan 20 02:58:54 1990 Welp, Phrack magazine is dead. Those of you who pay attention to BITNET know that the phrack accounts at U of M have been shut down. The story is as follows... Government agents (not sure of the dept., probably SS) have apparently been monitoring the e-mail of the Phrack kids (Knight Lightning & Taran King) for some time now. Apparently, a portion of a file sent to them (and subsequently published) contained copyrighted information. This is all they needed. They have now seized the entire Phrack net mailing list (over 500 accounts), plust every piece of information that Randy & Craig have (and they have a *LOT*) on real names, addresses and phone numbers. This is evolving directly out of the busts of three LOD members (Urvile, Leftist & Prophet). The Prophet (who is on probation) is apparently being threatened with a prison term if he doesn't cooperate. We don't know for sure if he cooperated or not, but what would you do in the same position? The same officials are apparently *VERY* interested in our co-sys, Mr. Bloodaxe. His net account is being watched, etc. I'll let him tell the story. Anyone wishing to communicate with Erik or myself should do so through the board only. I will be adding a secure (and I mean fucking secure) encryption routine into the e-mail in the next 2 weeks - I haven't decided exactly how to implement it, but it'll let two people exchange mail encrypted by a password only known to the two of them. Hmmmm... carry this conversation to the programming board. Anyway, I do not think I am due to be busted, but then again, I don't do anything but run a board. Still, there is that possibility. I assume that my lines are all tapped until proven otherwise. There is some question to the wisdom of leaving the board up at all, but I hae (have) personally phoned several government investigators and invited them to join us here on the board. If I begin to feel that the board is putting me in any kind of danger, I'll pull it down with no notice - I hope everyone understands. It looks like it's sweeps-time again for the feds. Let's hope all of us are still around in 6 months to talk about it. The Mentor Legion of Doom! 32/132: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sat Jan 20 07:50:12 1990 this is getting truly annoying.. Phoenix 33/132: Phrack, etc... Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sat Jan 20 09:30:10 1990 RE: phrack... I sounds to me as though the "SS" was really reaching. I mean, to get them on "copyright" violations is sort of like that had such a hard on for the phracboys it was as though they went after gangsters with income tax evasion! What is the legality of them spreading all of this information that they have obtained throughout the world? I mean, if they got names, etc.., isn't that private information? Do they or wl they publish all of it to the maniacsout there? 34/132: More news.... Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sat Jan 20 09:41:23 1990 AM-MilitaryHackers 01-18 0693 M-Military Hackers,0716< Break-In Shows Military Computer Vulnerable _ Prosecutor< SAN JOSE, Calif. (AP) _ Three Silicon Valley computer workers have been charged with breaking into government and telephone company computers in a case that prosecutors said Thursday demonstrates the vulnerability of those systems. The three are accused of committing what may be the first electronic invasion of a military computer network, according to one expert. A federal indictment charges them with obtaining flight orders for a military training exercise, of eavesdropping on private telephone conversations and getting FBI information on associates of the late Philippine president Ferdinand Marcos. The case ``does signal a vulnerability'' in the Pentagon's computers, U.S. Attorney Joseph Russoniello said Thursday at a news conference in San Francisco. The indictment, unsealed Wednesday in U.S. District Court in San Jose, is one of the first in the nation to use federal criminal statutes directed at computer crime, said assistant U.S. Attorney Robert K. Crowe in a news release. The charges, Crowe said, reveal ``the extreme vulnerability of the phone network.'' Charged were Kevin L. Poulsen, 24, a former employee of SRI International, a Menlo Park computer consulting company; Mark K. Lottor, 25, a current SRI employee; and Robert E. Gilligan, 31, who worked for computer-maker Sun Microsystems. ``Poulsen could do whatever he wanted to do with the telephone system as well as with government computers,'' Crowe said Wednesday. The three are charged with 19 counts of conspiracy; computer fraud; fraud involving computer access devices; using fictitious names or addresses; possession of electronic wiretapping devices; falsely repesenting a social security number; interception of electronic communications; embezzlement and theft of public property. Poulsen is named in 17 counts involving all of the offenses; Lottor is named in five counts and Gilligan named in seven counts. If convicted, Lottor and Gilligan face 20 years in prison and fines of $30,000. Poulsen could be sentenced to 37 years in prison and a $50,000 fine. According to the indictment, Poulsen used common burglary tools including surgical gloves, powdered graphite and lock picks, and forged a Pacific Bell employee card to steal the telecommunications equipment and access codes from the regional phone company's offices. Gilligan and Poulsen are accused of trafficking in codes that allow access to government computers through electronic mail. The pair got access to the Army's Masnet Computer Network, the indictment said without detailing uses of the computer. In late 1987 and early 1988, Poulsen got air tasking orders for a military exercise at Fort Bragg, N.C., called CPX Caber Dragon, the indictment said. The information, secret at the time, has been declassified because the event has already taken place, Russoniello said. The Marcos information was a computer list of phone numbers and cable assignments of Marcos and others that related to an FBI investigation, the indictment said. Peter G. Neumann, a computer security expert at SRI, said this was the first case he knew in which classified information was allegedly obtained by computer break-ins. The indictment accuses Poulsen of using his computer knowledge to obstruct the investigation into his alleged activities. Gilligan and Lottor were expected to surrender voluntarily. Poulsen, who called federal authorities but manipulated the computer so the call couldn't be traced, remained at large. Poulsen quit SRI in 1988 and took a job at Sun but later moved back to Los Angeles to live with his parents, said Donn Parker, security expert and senior management consultant with SRI. Poulsen was hired by SRI despite company officials' belief he once broke into a computer at the University of California, Los Angeles, Parker said. ``The people who hired him did know he had some hacker experience in his background, but he was a very bright guy,'' Parker said. They considered the earlier incident youthful excess, he said. The indictment doesn't indicate what authorities believe the men intended to do with the military secrets, but Parker said Poulsen told him several years ago that his youthful exploits were motivated by curiosity. ``I knew him as a typical young hacker. At least in past conversations he told me he was motivated by curiosity and the challenge to get into systems,'' Parker said. AP-NR-01-18-90 1936EST< 35/132: Phrack and Pac*Hell Name: Ripper #51 Date: Sat Jan 20 21:05:55 1990 Well- A copyright infringment isn't all that major that the SS would bust them for just that. I'm willing to bet they intercepted something bigger than a simple copyright piracy case. Although they would be interested since the information is being transported accross state (and quite likly) national boundries. About the San Jose case, sounds like they just got access to the TAN (Technical Access Network), and went from there. Along with their other antics, they'll prob get a prison term, because they are really strict on the wiretap bit. I don't get the part about the false names and addresses. The courts have said in the past, you can just pick a name out of the blue and use it, and you can give any kind of information (like a false address or phone number for instance) as long as the documentation is not for an official purpose and is not intended to defraud someone. I noticed Peter Neumann in there, he's a guy to listen to, and many of you might reconize him from the Risks forum on the net. He is one of the few public figures involved in computers that knows which way is up. Recap- Phrack will most likly get a slap on the wrist, but will have a sober look at the world, and won't be inclinded to be as high profile as they were. The San Jose case, I'm betting it'll turn high profile, and there will be alot of pressure for a nice long lock up. Most of this is based on my dealings with local, state, and federal law, as well as experience I gain while working for the County of San Diego. . 36/132: phrack Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 20 21:36:56 1990 I would think they knew of dealings between phrack & hackers/phreakers, but they had to have some real evidence in order to get in, once they did, they found much info that would make for a good prosecution... As any hacker knows, its the little things that matter DS 37/132: The Bottom line. Name: The Parmaster #21 Date: Sun Jan 21 10:05:38 1990 The bottom line is..a crackdown. We can now expect a crackdown because of the shit wiht the virus,the boys in cali,and the phrack kids.... The phrack boys were just the start, i'm sure of it.. I just hope that i can pull through this one..and that my friends can also. This is the time to watch yourself... No matter what you are into.. whether it's just codes,cards,etc... Apparently the government has seen the last straw in their point of view. Unfortunately with all of this in the news now, they will be able to get more government money to combat hackers. And thats BAD fucking news for us. I think they are going after all the "teachers" etc/.. people who educate others into this sort of thing.. (which i didn't need to say because it's obvious after what happened to randy & craig) i wonder if they think that maybe these remote cases are linked in any way.. The only way they can probably see is that we are hackers.. And so that is where their energies will be put.. To stop ALL hackers..and stop people BEFORE they can becomea threat.. After they wipe out the educators taht is. Just a theory. Par, Jason 38/132: Phrack Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sun Jan 21 13:09:20 1990 It's a scarry thought... - How did the intercept the information?? - An informatn, ok, that's legal.... but how private is electronic mail? Per haps we need a sub board to discuss some of these LEGAL issues... 39/132: ripper Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sun Jan 21 17:12:22 1990 Well, I know TK & KL pretty well, and they've been paranoid about doing *anything* illegal. I think the SS just had a hard-on to hassle them and this was the only excuse that they could come up with... Mentor 40/132: Well, Name: Warf #81 Date: Sun Jan 21 21:47:05 1990 I have somewone that is saying that he's gona' turn me into the pigs. IF something happends to me then don't worry. I'm gona' lay low for a while about a week or so.. so just dont' worry, BUT if something does start to involve you's then don't worry,, it won't.. heheh! <=[Warf]=> 41/132: Phrack Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Mon Jan 22 01:19:32 1990 Im not sure what to make out of the Phrack. I think the SS, FBI, and whoever has been waiting to bust them so long on ANYTHING that they waiting untill TK KL crossed the line in any way. I mean, hell..TK and KL were paraniod, and they suspected everything..so they stopped..and the SS, FBI and whoever had nothing to go on... Parmaster was right, TK and KL were "eductors"..a lot of hacks/phreaks looked up to them..maybe the SS and FBI thought that maybe if they couldnt get the little guys, then to go for "the big guys"..(same philosophy of the drug war, eh? Get the dealers, not the users?) Oh well.. I dunno..thats just my opinion... Shit, the public doesnt understand us enough for the government to declare war on us... Maybe if you collect everyones opinion on this, we can come to ONE conclusion.. The Dictator 42/132: Phrack Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 02:40:13 1990 Craig was very upset when I talked to him a few days ago. The Secret Service had been to their school and had taken all information off of their public accounts through the university...this included the ENTIRE phrack internet mailing list, future files, old issues, various lists of info on people they knew, etc... Craig assured me that they didn't go through his room, or even mess with his pc, but that didn't matter, as they got enough from the system at school. The problems stem from various articles published through Phrack, most specifically an article dealing with E911 that was written by The Prophet. They have said that this was stolen from a computer system, and was accepted and distributed knowing that it was illegally obtained propriatary information. (The Prophet was one of the 3 LOD members busted this summer in Atlanta) This led to various questions dealing with LOD in general and a great deal of hazing towards Craig. For the most part, they pulled the same crap: "We know what you did, so if you're smart you'll talk, or we'll make your life shit." And the other approach, "Look, we know you're a smart kid with a bright future and we really wouldn't want to see you fuck things up." Basic cop bullshit. Craig was visited first by 3 agents, and Randy was supposedly to be visited the following day. (They are at different schools now) They were interested in the Telenet Directory, The EFT Files, which by now, everyone knows that I wrote, since they had been grabbing the boys e-mail. That pisses me off greatly, as Electronic Mail is supposed to be covered under the same protection as regular mail now, or so I understood. I thought it was a felony to interfere with peoples mail. Can you commit a felony, to stop a suspected one from occurring? I hope not...hell, maybe Noriega is in charge now... In anycase, I think I'm in for a world of shit... 43/132: MY feelings about this fucked up situation Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 03:31:01 1990 I do not live in a fascist country...or so I thought. INformation is withheld, people are threatened daily by an elite group of Government thugs who operate above the law, hell, what do you call that kind of bullshit? I'm growing more and more pissed by the minute...if I do get nabbed, which I semi-expect to, so you SS boys take a good look at this, I am dangerous. Maybe not in a physical manner, although I'm kinda suicidal, and don't know how I'll be on any given day, and I've only tried to kill my roomate once with a big knife, and I've only broken wine bottles over two people... But, I am dangerous in that I'm quite eloquent and VERY outspoken on topics about which I feel strongly. Guess what? I kinda have a personal leaning towards computer crime. Think carefully about reprocussions world-wide when reporters find out just how insecure your precious Internet is, or think about the stock fluctuations on Fortune 500 companies when their shareholders find out just how easily the company cuuld be shut down for a few days with a few keystrokes, or consider the implications following just a few choice comments about the lack of security at large banking institutions...hell, How fucking skilled does someone have to be to sit on a nua and capture every fucking Saudi Visa? (No offense Par) but that shit is totally rediculous. Security is pathetic, and the ones who can fix it, or at least point it out are supressed, and placed in jail. Fuck that. If that's what you expect to do to me, then you had better be prepared to blow my fucking head off when you kick in the door, because I will be heard. ->ME 44/132: Another thing... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 03:57:05 1990 Warf: who the hell are you that your bust could worry anyone but yourself? Hell, I know I'll be up all night now. Hell, maybe your problems all stem from posting bad things on bbses where they don't belong. I'm still pissed...everyone else ignore me, things get clearer on a few subboards after this...WARF fucked up...don't you be next. ->ME 45/132: Attention Feds Name: Black Magic #54 Date: Mon Jan 22 04:26:40 1990 Being Mr. Bloodaxe's roommate I do have one small request. We sleep late around here, so please delay any breaking down of doors or other noisy activity until after 12:00 pm. His room is the one on the RIGHT at the top of the stairs just to avoid confusion (our descriptions are very similar and I realize that you fucks aren't all that bright.) Also, be sure not to let the cat out. Just prop the door back up on it's hinges or put him in a bathroom while exercising the warrant. Thanks, Chris (what a coincidence huh) 46/132: Hum... Name: Warf #81 Date: Mon Jan 22 07:41:16 1990 I think the way this is set up is wierd. I loged on new the other day and I could read all of the messages and all of the message beses. Hum... so that means that some cop get's the number right? And then he sees all of these phreakers and stuff and then boom. We're all gona' be with each other in the same cell for about 5 yrs min... Hum.. SysOp, could you make it a LITTLE more secure? Just helpin' out... <=[Warf]=> 47/132: well Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 22 09:21:39 1990 as long as nothing illegal is not posted.. the board is ine.. well... All i have to say is that i ss/eds/or in my case CIA start playing dirty.. we have been very nice in general about everything.. In act I cannot think o anytime when i have bought a system down.. But i it comes to it... we can ight ire with ire.. coz i seriously agree wiuth erik.. and when you guys start breaking the law to get at us... well.. what the hell is the law or... i never liked the damn thing anyway.. jesus.. as a inal note... i will set up some sort o insurance... not just or mysel... but or anyone who needs it... and cant provide it or themselves.. we can play below board just as much as any authorities can... so there Phoenix 48/132: security Name: Phase Jitter #3 Date: Mon Jan 22 10:51:04 1990 The reason you could read everything is because this board is for education purposes. It is not used for ANY illegal information trading. There is no point to have it secured, because there is nothing illegal on here.. Phase Jitter Legion o' Doom! (The few, the proud) 49/132: dumb feds Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Jan 22 14:11:13 1990 Kill 'em all..as I like to say. Seriously, what can they prove if you are a safe hacker? (hacking via outdials, phreaking with divertors only..no codes etc. nothing traceable) They can't prove a damn thing. So what do they do, but nail you on something trivial like copyright violation. All that shows is that they have such a weak case that there is nothing solid to bust on. Enough rambling for this paragraph... What we need to do is set up a hackers network where everyone has their hands in a few systems. That way, we have this sort of insurance that Phoenix talked about: if one hacker gets busted 2 systems _die_. 2 hackers get busted 4 systems bite the dust. 3 hackers...9 systems. They need to quit messing with people who wouldn't otherwise be harmful to the computer world. I know there are freeloaders around that get their kicks from trashing Apple][ boards and unixes, but this doesn't represent the majority of the hacker population. It sure doesn't represent me! grey owl 50/132: busts Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Mon Jan 22 15:33:56 1990 I dont think that would be a very wise idea... It would just cause the "authorities" and the general public to look toward us as destroyers, not explorers... The ONLY times I have killed a system is when I really get pissed off that the sysop keeps changing all the operator passwords (well... so maybe i am a little malicious at times, but not like some people on this board) DS 51/132: Arg... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 18:22:55 1990 Wiping out systems as a means of retribution, or vengance for a fellow hacer's bust is NOT a good idea. You cannot take a bully approach when dealing with the world biggest bully (The US Government) you will lose. You have only one manner of defense, and that is to outsmart your opponent, or to publicly humiliate him when faced with immediate danger. By the way: Phoenix, how come you can never type an "f" when it's in a word, but when you are complaining about your broken "F" key, it shows up fine? COnfused as to the wonders of technology... ->ME 52/132: Back Phracks... Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Mon Jan 22 21:59:17 1990 Whoever ul the back phracks, I have 29 and 30 if they are needed and a local doesn't have them. -PHz 53/132: hello Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Mon Jan 22 23:28:09 1990 hello all, to those that know why..leave me mail...and you SHOULD know who you are as I have not talked to you for 7 mos or so...SO GET ON THE STICK. to everyone else..well you can leave me mail if you choose..but ... pth 54/132: Resistance Name: Jedi #67 Date: Tue Jan 23 01:42:42 1990 We came across a fun article on p/h and pirating as a form of "post-modern" resistance by a coupla academic types. If anybody wants, I can dig up a copy and upload it 55/132: well Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Jan 23 06:48:33 1990 maybve we should think about what type o insurance we need.. ok.. agreed... bringing down systems will only piss them off more.. and make us look even worse.. public humiliation... that would do it... but not all individuals who get bustedhave the resources to deend themselves with... also... once your information is bought out in public.. your cards are played.. and then they will tear you apart.. i think the saest thing here is a little bit o blackmail if you have something that they really dont want aqnyone to know about.. still... im open to suggestions... phoenix 56/132: well.... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Tue Jan 23 13:23:30 1990 seems to me that the best way to embarass them would be to obtain and publish the internal files. many of these contain memoranca and notes on activities that were not used in court, because of various legal questions, and were only used for background. i understand that there is a group of police enforcement officials who have a unofficial and under the table groupl who share information on a lot of folks. houston and la were kicked out a couple of years ago because officers would release the info into the public domain. as to the copyright info. try to get it through the library or the field service engineer. if it can be gotten that way it cant be called proprietary and my experience w/ field engineers is that they will get just about everything you could ask for if you can give them specifics about what you want. 57/132: Savage Name: Signal Type #69 Date: Tue Jan 23 14:44:33 1990 Well I agree with the above posts regarding the proper way with to deal with authorities. You should not use any violent means to take down or destroy systems. That will only make them more than not to come down on you harder. By the way did anyone hear the news on that guy who got busted for breaking into a government mainframe? I didn't get all the details but it seemed he is facing up to $$200,000 in f fines and a possible five year prison term. A pretty stiff price. $$$$$$Signal Type$$$$$ .s 58/132: morris Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Jan 23 21:57:27 1990 Robert Morris was found guilty. If he's sentenced to do time, it'll be a *very* bad precedent. Mentor 59/132: BLackmail? Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 23 22:51:58 1990 Geez...I'd like to think myself above things like that... In anycase, not everyone has GOOD sensitive information...(not all of us who ARE in this country have the balls to dig where that type of crap is...god I want to move to Australia!) Maybe they'll kick me out of the country! Right...I'm not that important, although I would like to think that I am...hehe hell, maybe it IS time to start doing all the terrible things I always had the capabilities to do on the internet...need to get some "Insurance" maybe...who knows... ->ME 60/132: well Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Wed Jan 24 01:29:23 1990 like i said... im open to better ideas.. coz i we do have sensitive ino... then no matter what we do with it... it will be termed blackmail.. Phoenix4 61/132: Morris Convicted Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Wed Jan 24 04:43:24 1990 If RTM get's jail time we should all be suprised. What he did was morrally and ethically wrong, and he fucked upt and will now have to pay the piper. However, hej is a very bright person and should not be put in a jail cell with a bunch of hardended ass f**king criminals! Hopefully he'll get some sort of community service and a fine, and this will be enough to kkeep him from fucking up the network in the future. 62/132: i understand... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Wed Jan 24 14:34:03 1990 that the prosecution had a hard time showing malitous (sp!) intent. does anyone know if that is true? if it is true then i doubt he will get any time. probably a fine, community service, a probated time. what is the latest on the ccc guys? have they taken them out and shot them yet? in my previous post i was refering to the publication, through tv, radio,and paper, of sensitive information held by organizations. it would not have to be identified as to sender. therer are plenty of underground, small town, press services (hey how about the gossip rags?) that would be ideal to send that kind of stuff to. not only that but what about the up wire? you could put it in que and it would go all over. 63/132: gossip rags Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 24 19:08:07 1990 If it went to the Enquirer they would just claim that Enquirer made it all up. If the information got to NBC's evening news they might just take it and run. It would make a good news story if what Phoenix says is true. Maybe blackmail or internet death threats are the answer. "I'll take down Inet unless bloodaxe goes free!" grey owl 64/132: 2 new subs, & vote! Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Jan 24 19:51:24 1990 We've got two new subs online - We The People (now #2) and Internet (#8). Also, please take the time to vote... Mentor 65/132: oh Name: Dtmf #27 Date: Thu Jan 25 02:58:38 1990 RE: phrack... Just how much of a problem will it be if an account is on the Phrack mailing list for bitnet?? Uh oh.... 66/132: and... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Thu Jan 25 15:26:36 1990 would those accounts be gone already? I had 2 accounts that i had contacted & conversed with TK, and they are both bad (coincedence?) DS 67/132: things... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Thu Jan 25 16:45:23 1990 Don't worry about your name being on the Phrack mailing list...a lot of peoples were... I am going to try to get the mailing list myself, so we can keep people flooded with files and shit like that...not Phrack, but something... Randy & Craig shouldn't bitch, as hell, the feds already have it...why shouldn't a friend? If they still say no, I'll make my own list and start from there... ->ME 68/132: Hey ... Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Thu Jan 25 20:28:57 1990 re: phrack Erik, what's wrong with the continual releasal of Phrack. Why not go ahead and release Phrack 31 (32?). I mean seriously, what more could piss of the feds (or whoever). I mean it. Seriously, if we just start some new newsletter, its not going to be any different, but by their viewpoint, they'd have destroyed a publication that is dated as far back as 1986 or 1985. If we continue to release Phrack's, and I mean put some HARRY shit in there, we would show them that they cannot just pull us down. We're unified, we're strong, and we're willing to stand up to them. [Of course, I don't mean personally. grin.] "They tell me it will hurt me on down the line, but I don't care. I'm young and stupid." Sic. 69/132: phracks Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Thu Jan 25 22:02:20 1990 Why not come up an almost untraceable method of distributing phracks thru internet? (IE many distributions originating from nowwhere via smtp to many people at a time) DS (we could use the existing phrack mailing list if you can get it,Erik) 70/132: Thats damn easy Name: Guc #97 Date: Fri Jan 26 06:04:31 1990 just an estimate, how many people were on the mailing list? heh, we could even send them out using richard stallmans account! .s 71/132: heh Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Fri Jan 26 10:06:26 1990 I believe there were about 500 people on the list... Mentor 72/132: yea... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Jan 26 16:23:40 1990 And, I was just wondering, because my account went bad just 2 days (approximately) after I had just finished discussion with TK about setting up an FTP site for the phracks... I know I was on it because I got some letter (to 2 of my accounts, which both are dead now) talking about a pirate-oriented newsletter organized like phrack... I just thought it is very much a possibility that that is the reason it got deleted. DS 73/132: ya know... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Fri Jan 26 17:15:32 1990 Phrack is Randy & Craigs baby...I would have to respect their wishes about using the name...I doubt they would want me to use it...they'd probably let Forest Ranger run it into the ground before they'd let me, but that's the way they probably think... I'd rather start something a little better written, better formatted, with better articles under a different name. ->ME 74/132: that Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Fri Jan 26 22:25:07 1990 sounds like something I would have done. Most of the articles were well written, I think but there were a few things that I would have changed. grey owl 75/132: Phrack etc.... Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Sat Jan 27 01:43:38 1990 Okay, I haven't been on for a few days and I just went through a slew of messages. First off, I happen to know a guy who is security at TK and KL's school (TK's ex-school). This guy, he says that he knows nothing about the mess and seemed to think it was a big story. I don't know if he is just blowing hot air up my ass or what...probably. He said he would keep his ears open for me, probably back stab, we shall see. I agree with all of those that say Phrack (or another newsletter/magazine) should continue. Those close to KL and TK should talk to them about a name. I had written an article for Phrack 31, which I am willing to submit for this new venture if it gets off the ground. About distribution, I know of a few anonymous FTP sites that will let you PUT stuff. Usually folks use these to swap .GIF files, but they could be used for whatever. Perhaps a 'girlie' magzine could be created. PUT the newsletter, a text file, as a name like FATBABE.GIF. Those that GET it either know what it is or think their .GIF viewer is fried. Anyone who GETs it not knowing what it is and finds out, so what? It doesn't have to have anyones addresses in it. Whats your opinion friend? About gettting even/back, blackmail etc. Being destructive is not good for previously posted reasons. How about us collectively writing a story and sending it to the AP or something? We, as a team, can get the story better than any reporter. I seriously thought about calling the damn SS saying i'm Dan Rather or something and asking what the deal with Randy and Craig is. What the FEDS did with this pseudo-bust is only gain information about who is *who* and where etc. This is the easiest information for them to get anyways. Often thats because of p/h -ers narcing on each other (read the PHRACK circle trilogy if you haven't). If the SS knew that Joe Hacker did something and they found out that Joe Hacker's internet address is such in such. They know that some one calling themself (lves?) Joe Hacker used that account. Whether it was the real owner or not remains to be proved. The burden of proof is on them. Still, if handles didn't matter, no one would use them anyways. well shit. this is getting long.... Subscribe to VIRUS-L at LEHIIBM1, I have the director of CERT's net address: its rdp@sei.cmu.(???).edu (Richard Pethia). -PHz 76/132: screw it.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sat Jan 27 07:26:42 1990 distribution is damn damn easy... smtp every where for one.. and a shit load of other things will work most merrily.. Phoenix 77/132: Why? Name: The Parmaster #21 Date: Sat Jan 27 09:38:59 1990 Why just "send it" to AP Just take over the damn system and release it. that way you KNOW it';s done.. and it's sent out almost immediately. Later, Par Jason 78/132: Getting scarry.... Name: Johnny Hicap #45 Date: Sat Jan 27 21:17:01 1990 It is getting scarry as hell now a days. I know of three hackers that got busted in the last couple of days, ther handles will not be released by me but those who know them are probably shocked. I can't beleive豪 it. Situation: Someone gets busted for prgming switches, hacking LMOS, COSMOS, and all the ��other phone company comp. He calls me from his line the next day to tell me..(Direct) Question: Do you think they are now monortoring me? Afer all he did call me direct. They probably are... 79/132: UT micom/network annex Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 27 22:03:45 1990 Well, it looks like everyones pushed the UT administrators to disabling all links from off-campus... We can no longer telnet to off-campus sytems thru network... For awhile you could use UTAUS, but know logins there are disabled because they are turning off the cabality to telnet off-campus. I was on EMX just a few minutes ago telnet'ing to frosted-flakes.ai.mit.edu when I was kicked off, and I keep getting kicked off (same thing that happens at the annex when you tryo telnet off-campus). All those people shouldnt have used the systems to hack so much and (mainly this) play GAMES like TINYMUD! The UT administrators were getting tired of all the annex ports always being full. DS plus, not to mention, all the security problems that they have had with the Suns.) Maybe it has to do with people changing passwords on "act" accounts...... You know who you are !!!! 80/132: people who abuse Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sat Jan 27 23:49:09 1990 Look: I have one thing to say to people who screw up/abuse/ruin systems for other hackers...you suck. There is no point in screwing something, otherwise a perfectly good system, for everyone else. If you get your kicks from trashing systems for the hell of it, your shouldn't call yourself a hacker. Maybe asshole would be a good term for these people. grey owl 81/132: re: ppl who abuse... Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Sun Jan 28 02:20:45 1990 The true hacker works hard to make their presence unknown. Screwing up accounts or a system is easy. nuff said -PHz 82/132: Things... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Sun Jan 28 13:31:38 1990 First off...if the "BUST" you are referrong to is Mark & Joey and some other Queens punk, I think that is bullshit. A friend of mine talked to Mark a few days ago (after the reported bust) and Mark said nothing about it. Programming switches, hacking LMOS...busted...well, we'll see. If it is true, hell, chalk up another LOD bust and we'll scratch Phiber Optik off the active list... Mark? You been busted boy? Another thing...Dark Sun: you little thug...I didn't change the pw on your fucking act account, so stop your incessant whining about it...accounts on the disney suns are terribly easy to run through a dictionary hacker, so do that if you so desparately want back on them...there is NOTHING there...and if a CHAT thing ends up on there and I find it, I'll be pissed off...run that off of ugwa, or whatever. Why do you want on there anyway? Why do you have to make such a big deal with the fucking public access unixes? THERE IS NOTHING ON THOSE SYSTEMS!!! I will not lose my account due to someone hacking off of the disney suns...ok? jesus...is that asking too fucking much? ->ME 83/132: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sun Jan 28 14:08:56 1990 i changed the password on that act account.. got root off it too.. umm.. ut still lets you call off campus if you use the right systems... by the way... what is that instructional vax cluster used for ? phoenix 84/132: yeah... Name: Guc #97 Date: Sun Jan 28 16:49:33 1990 RE: hmm you can get off campus IF you use a password on a system and do it from there. (ie: cs, if, emx, etc...) But without a password there is noway to get off campus. i asked a friend of mine at the computation center about this and he said it was done mainly because people were hack/trashing systems on the internet, and even more so a bunch of 12 year olds somehow found out about tinymud. one afternoon i saw 7 annex ports logged into tinymud from portal1. gah .s 85/132: phoenix Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sun Jan 28 17:24:04 1990 I was talking about phoenix... He said he was going to change it back but then decided to keep it for himself... And I know how easy it is to run thru a dictionary hacker (check act's home dir...) Erik didnt even know the passwd (Idont think) DS 86/132: !@#)(* Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sun Jan 28 22:54:40 1990 John M??? T%hat wouldn't be as in "Cable Pair" would it? 87/132: no.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 29 02:48:09 1990 i didnt decide to keep it or mysel... 88/132: john m Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Mon Jan 29 17:59:09 1990 Whos Cable Pair? 89/132: cable pair... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 29 18:56:56 1990 John Maxfield aka Cable Pair... Notorious detroit fuckhead hacker buster & child molester. hehe ->ME 90/132: Cat-wares Name: The Jabberwocky #100 Date: Tue Jan 30 00:15:01 1990 Does anyone out there have anything to utilize the enormous possibilities of the AppleCat modem? I used to have a few nifties, but that was a while back and over the past half-decade that I have been out of circulation(got bored) I have lost all wares except the piece-o-shit Com-ware II. This kitten will sing any song imaginable of pretty mf tones and even had a voice simulator which makes for quite a bit of fun. Anything which someone could u/l would be greatly appreciated. -The Jabberwocky 91/132: hello Name: Corrupt #114 Date: Tue Jan 30 08:11:40 1990 Damn!..finally got up on here as shit is tight....be looking forward 2 shooting the gift with ya'll shit..lemme x-late...wassup>? the 2600 meeting is this friday here in New york....I'm sure some interesting things will be gleeaned therefrom..if I make it.. Be Careful Everyone...(Ithats a sentimental reitiration..shit..(sp))) Corrupt[8lgm] 92/132: ammy hack warez... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Tue Jan 30 10:53:04 1990 what are the names for some of the hack utilities for an ammy? thx ahead of time. ravage rip the system 93/132: ... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Tue Jan 30 15:57:47 1990 I run a AmyHack Discussion Center. I think those files you are looking for are on there. The 4th Dimension! 619-745-1xxx. Login PW-SPECTRUM. Newuser PW-Gunship. 94/132: tak/scan Name: Ravage #19 Date: Tue Jan 30 21:38:19 1990 thanks, expect to get a call from my direction in the next few days. 95/132: tak Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Jan 30 22:48:56 1990 Could you u/l the amy hacking stuff to the Commodore directory? Thanks! me 96/132: Thanks a lot people Name: The Inspectre #63 Date: Tue Jan 30 23:03:17 1990 Now I can't even get onto the network from UT Micom. I have programs due for classes I have to work on on those computers. Now I've gotta go down to the stupid terminal room and wait around about 6 hrs for some goob to get off the sun terminals. 97/132: umm.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Wed Jan 31 04:01:56 1990 sorry.. but i wasnt the one playing ANY games.. 98/132: .. Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 31 14:35:05 1990 Yeah. Who the fuck was playing all these port 42something games on chaos besides Dark Sun? I was going to do some FTPing and hacking and I noticed that 5 or 6 people were logged on to the same port on chaos... Come on people! This is retarted. grey owl 99/132: 2600 and the Internet Source Code Name: Dark Overlord #94 Date: Thu Feb 01 04:01:21 1990 I will like to state that 2600's selling of the internet Worm source code was done without my knowage and I am not getting (or want) a cent. I think this is very slimy of them. -Dark 100/132: well.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Thu Feb 01 10:06:58 1990 i did lots of hacking at ut... so i played a major part in its downfall in that area.. but never ever once did i play a single game off there.. still.. i take FULL responsibility for stufing up the IV# vax cluster.. grr... did a login patch.. and set off an audit alarm.. that wasnt problem.. problem was that then i rushed.. and when i left, forgot to reset privs on loginout, so everyone could log back in, but no-one could log out moral: never ever rush a patch!! phoenix 101/132: port 42 Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Thu Feb 01 14:19:42 1990 Whats that??? If you mean 4201, I havent even looked at it for several weeks... DS 102/132: ... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Thu Feb 01 16:06:43 1990 Yeah Mentor and others I will upload some a my hacking shit. not to much they suck anyways./ but I will still dot it.... The 4th Dimension! 619-745-1xxx. Login PW-SPECTRUM. Newuser PW-Gunship. Tak/Scan 103/132: FSA Name: Corrupt #114 Date: Fri Feb 02 05:51:25 1990 yo..you know how i get..lemme just say this ya'll **** **** * **** * * * * * * * * * ** *** * * ** * * * * * * * Africa * * * * * * * * *** Free South Africa - - - $ Nelson Mandella ..let the guy goalready! :-) 2600 meeting today..I'm gonna have some fun..we're gonna shoot homeMovies!! (thats sorrta a joke,...dunno if u get it.) 104/132: 4201 Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Fri Feb 02 21:54:10 1990 Unless you're calling through and outdial, it's not a good idea to do anything other than hack. This is only my opinion. grey owl 105/132: what?! Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Feb 02 23:09:50 1990 Its a helluva lot safer to play a game than hack! DS 106/132: uh... Name: Guc #97 Date: Sat Feb 03 06:29:48 1990 could someone please give a quick tutorial on how to make use of the info in xfer section 12? .s 107/132: What is Phrack? Name: Warf #81 Date: Sat Feb 03 18:20:25 1990 Is it like some BBS Mag.? <=[Warf]=> 108/132: things Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sat Feb 03 18:32:10 1990 I'm not talking about safety. When you're on the system and things are getting logged, it's not worthwhile to be playing games. You can do that legally. If you have to spend time under the log, it's best to make it productive. Phrack is a magazine that has been the longest standing electronically distributed magazine available. The articles are always informative and usually good! grey owl 109/132: UT Micom Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Sat Feb 03 19:12:17 1990 I am pissed... people are abusing the hell out of it just to play games. Dark Sun is one of the worst... For some reason he finds it necessary to play whatever he plays and do it online at UT. This is getting everyone in trouble, and I know Erik ain't exactly ecstatic (sp?) about some FTP getting shut down. Daneel Olivaw 110/132: hey Name: Corrupt #114 Date: Sat Feb 03 20:57:24 1990 You I went to the 2600 meeting..sanme ole stuff..running thru a AT&T building with flare guns..ranking and dissing..drinking and picking up women(men?) had sum fun..got rowdy.and ofcourse..a little talkabout this and that broing stuff..computers.. the Resteraunt with the nude girls was cool..the best part was On the Subway buggin out...singing..nmaybeI7ll sing here one day..dunno :-)) I also Managed To write MORE vms software..and got a BBS site together on the network..anyone Interested in checking it out (it's in new Zealand) Mail me here or On Altos [tchh] as vaxer or on QSD as box ...the info for the board is on Altos[tchh]Bullet as well but ideas/comments/complaints/a nd bugs can be mailed 2 me here as well. It's Semi-private? naw..I think thats the Last work I'll do..when i Complete the chatV4.0 and see it online I'll retire my keyboard for a bit . have A Good one/Be Safe network Ninjitsu GaiDan[8lgm]Corrupted 111/132: ... Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sat Feb 03 22:02:43 1990 AM-ComputerCrimes 02-02 0151 AM-Computer Crimes,140< Criminals Have Discovered Computers< WASHINGTON (AP) _ Criminals have discovered the value of computers and are using them ``in crimes of unprecedented economic cost,'' the National Instiute of Justice said Friday. The institute cited a recent accounting firm study that estimated $3 billion to $5 billion in thefts each year by high-tech criminals. ``Increasingly, computers are being found in the illegal activities of drug networks,'' said Attorney General Dick Thornburgh. ``Drug traffickers use them to communicate with each other, record their transactions and transfer and launder money.'' The crimes include electronic funds transfer fraud and theft of commercial inventories. The report mentioned a former insurance firm employee in Fort Worth, Texas, who used a program to delete more than 160,000 records from the company's computer and also a prostitution ring that had a data base of more than 80,000 clients, their credit card numbers and sexual preferences. AP-NR-02-02-90 1516EST< 112/132: Hey, Name: Black Death #95 Date: Sun Feb 04 00:16:37 1990 Call the Unholy temple 408-249-5xxx New user password is "the Temple" have phun 113/132: ... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Sun Feb 04 03:26:28 1990 Killer. I am going to set up something via - then nwetworks really soon i will keep you posted.. in the meantime- The 4th Dimension! 619-745-1xxx. Login PW-SPECTRUM. Newuser PW-Gunship. 114/132: Network BBSs Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Sun Feb 04 11:43:35 1990 Well, I have been interested in running a BBS on VM for sometime. I have the code for such and am quite capable of writing it anyway. Anyone else a REXX phreak? Anyways, it has been quite difficult to find a safe VM account on Bitnet (or any net running RSCS/JNET/JES2 and its compatibles). The requirements are that it is TELNET-able, has at least 2 cylinders of disk space, is able to run in DSC indefinately, and that the admins don't care about RSCS traffic. If you have such an account and are interested in running a BBS/Chat/Fileserver plz get im touch with me. On another note, CERT.SEI.CMU.EDU does have a receive directory (FTP) so feel free to leave you interesting notes for others there. -PHz 115/132: games Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sun Feb 04 17:47:49 1990 Tell me some evidence to support your theory that I am one of the worst game players at UT! very interesting that you think that... DS 116/132: AIDS VIrus Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Sun Feb 04 20:11:46 1990 PM-Computer-Extortion 02-02 0333 PM-Computer-Extortion,0344< Man Arrested in Alleged Computer Extortion< CLEVELAND (AP) _ A zoologist accused of unleasing a computer virus that crippled computers in England and other countries two months ago was arrested on a fugitive warrant in Ohio. Joseph W. Popp was arrested Thursday and is being held on a federal fugitive warrant. He is charged in warrants issued by Scotland Yard in London with blackmail and extortion. During an initial court appearance here today, Popp, 39, told U.S. Magistrate Joseph W. Bartunek that he is under a psychiatrist's care and must take drugs for a mental condition. Bartunek said he would schedule another hearing after two psychiatrists evaluate Popp to see whether he is competent to face further proceedings. A date was not set. Popp, a zoologist who worked for the World Health Organization, is from Willowick, about 10 miles east of Cleveland, said defense attorney John P. Kilroy. It was not immediately clear whether Popp is still affiliated with the organization. The warrant alleges Popp distributed about 20,000 computer-crippling disks from London around Dec. 11. The disks were labeled ``AIDS Information Introductory Diskette.'' The U.S. attorney's office in Cleveland said the disks had information on acquired immune deficiency syndrome for use by hospitals, researchers and others. But authorities said the disks, when inserted into personal computers by unsuspecting recipients, halted accessibility to any other information in the computer. At the end of the program, the disk asked the computer user for a leasing fee of up to $378, then printed an invoice with a Panama address where money was to be sent, federal prosecutors said. Computer owners were told that the rogue program they had inserted in their computer would stop the machine from functioning unless the money was paid. At the time the diskette began causing problems in early December, authorities in London said it had been received by users in Norway, Sweden and Denmark as well as Britain. Scotland yard said at least 10 British computers were affected. AP-NR-02-02-90 1328EST< 117/132: Dark Sun's gaming evidence Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Feb 04 21:14:41 1990 Whenever I did a 'who' from the annex it would show that you were playing games. I know it was you because I would log on to a unix and you would imediately notice that I was there. Also, whenever I went to 4201 (that one time) to see what was up, you were showing me around. grey owl 118/132: arg... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Feb 05 00:30:58 1990 Arg...ok, so Dark Sun is the TinyMUD gaming thug...or at least one of them... what a drag. I've half a mind to wipe out the damn program altogether. Download the source and stick it elsewhere so you and your buds can play it and not bother actual college activities, so people like inspectre can do their fucking homework. Hell, if it's that important for you mindless pre-pubescent twits to play fucking games call the ACT system and play their silly mud-like game, or call fucking MUD in england on the x-25 networks!!! if you need the nua for mud, or the number to ACT here in austin, just ask! But from now on fucking think about what the hell you are doing! Network only has so many queues! ->ME 119/132: NUA's Name: Captain Crook #36 Date: Mon Feb 05 22:10:25 1990 What are the NUA's for MUD and ACT?? 120/132: what the hell? Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Tue Feb 06 00:11:22 1990 are you talking about (is this some kinda 'revenge'?? When did I show you aroumd and what account was I using? I only have 1 account on there. And since I had my emx accounts (2 months) I havent even USED annex... I can get my 37 telnet sessions and my 3 outdial sessions going on at the same time, why use annex? DS 121/132: Watts happening to the hacking community Name: Cassius Cray #135 Date: Tue Feb 06 06:11:39 1990 Shit guys... a year and a half ago we were on top of the fucking world... now it is general mayhem and feds on every corner... I got into hacking the beginning of last year then I read in the paper about some guys at Ga Tech got fucked so I decided to take a vacation and read.... I heard about good guys up in New York, Detriot, and Chicago getting there shit seized by the feds... I don't know what ever happen to the guys at Ga Tech but the other guys are definately FUCKED.... what a turn around.... I am beginning to believe the Feds are starting to take this shit seriously!! Oh well... guess we could all go backing to pirating software... Nah! Cassius Cray 122/132: What happens is... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Tue Feb 06 17:33:07 1990 people like Dark Sun who have "37 telnet and 3 oudial" sessions going at once. This seems to attract attention... I dunno why... gee, doesn't every CS major do that.. Shit, are you so stupid that you don't realize what attracts attention. They notice if there are 15 people (of 16) logged in under the same name at the same time. Daneel Olivaw 123/132: another round of busts.... Name: Gordon Meyer #65 Date: Tue Feb 06 20:27:33 1990 Today the feds announced, in a Chicago Press conference, that indictments have been brought against The Prophet and Knight Lightning for theft and other related "computer" crimes. (I didn't catch the rest of the charges). See my message in the Phrack section for more info. I've got the VCR set to record the news tonight so maybe I can cull some more info, but no doubt it will be all over the papers tomorrow. Holy shit batman! CIAO! -=->G<-=- 124/132: DNR's Name: Vet-San #29 Date: Tue Feb 06 21:21:59 1990 I'm in a bit of a fix here... I have reason to believe that there may be a DNR on my line. Can someone tell me how I can find out for sure? Do I just walk up to the local courthouse and demand to know, fiegning jingoistic paranoia? Any assistance will be appriciated... thanx 125/132: heh Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Feb 06 22:41:06 1990 Yeah, that might work. Or try the local switch. Generally, though, I think you're just screwed... Mentor 126/132: A World of Your Own Name: The Prophet #104 Date: Tue Feb 06 23:55:15 1990 Imagine that you're deaf, dumb, blind, and paralyzed from the neck down and totally unable to experience or communicate with the outside world. How long could you retain your sanity? How many of you would choose to die instead? How many of you think you could muster the willpower to create your own little mental world to live in for the rest of your life, and how long do you think the hospital would wait before putting you out of your misery? -The Prophet 127/132: DNRs Name: Nemesis #122 Date: Wed Feb 07 00:55:49 1990 Well, you can check for DNRs (and all the info they have recorded) on your local neighbprhood LMOS system...Other than that.. I would suggest a little SEing with your local fone co.. Just keep trying untill you find someone who doesnt know whats going on, and have them check it for you.. The basic idea is to dial repair and work your way in farther from there...how far you will have to go depends on how gulible the person you talk to is...But asside from that, since a DNR now a days (at least on my fone--I duno what typs of SS you are on), is all digital, and totaly undetectable by any simple means. 128/132: Body Name: Sventek #137 Date: Wed Feb 07 02:13:46 1990 Once i loose my senses and Motion i am out of the picture. Other words no mental visons of anything. That would bring me in line of INsanity and Psychotic state of being. sl8r Sventek 129/132: what next Name: Sector #123 Date: Wed Feb 07 13:40:43 1990 PM-911Hackers 02-07 0449 PM-911 Hackers,0462< ^Two Charged with Breaking into Nine-State 911 Emergency Phone Network< ^By PAUL A. DRISCOLL= ^Associated Press Writer= CHICAGO (AP) _ A computer hacker broke into the 911 emergency telephone network covering nine states in the South and another intruder passed on the access data to other hackers, authorities said. Robert J. ``The Prophet'' Riggs, 20, of Decatur, Ga., and Craig M. ``Knight Lightning'' Neidorf, 19, of Chesterfield, Mo., were indicted Tuesday by a federal grand jury and accused of computer crimes, said acting U.S. Attorney Ira H. Raphaelson. He said Riggs was a member of the so-called Legion of Doom hackers group, whose members are involved in numerous illegal activities. Riggs and two other alleged members also were indicted Tuesday in Atlanta and charged in other computer break-ins. The government would not say if any emergency calls were disrupted or whether other damage was done during the tampering. ``These were not teen-agers playing games,'' Raphaelson said. ``They are thieves, they're reckless and they're dangerous.'' In the Chicago case, Riggs is accused of entering Atlanta-based Bell South's 911 system with a computer, stealing a copy of the program that controls the system and publishing this data on a hackers' computer bulletin board in Lockport. Neidorf is accused of transferring the data to his computer at the University of Missouri in Columbia, where he allegedly edited it for a computer hacker publication known as PHRACK. There was no immediate comment from either defendant. Directory information had no listing for Riggs, and there was a recorded message at the Neidorf residence. Neidorf's attorney, Art Margulis, said he had not seen the indictment so he could not comment. Raphaelson said industry specialists estimate that $3 billion to $5 billion is lost yearly to computer fraud. He said this is the fourth hacker case brought by the federal government in the past year. Bell South's 911 controls emergency calls to municipal police, fire, ambulance and emergency services in Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, Tennessee, Kentucky, Louisiana, North Carolina, South Carolina and Florida. ``People who invade our telecommunications and related computer systems for profit or personal amusement create immediate and serious consequences for the public at large,'' said Raphaelson. He said the 911 data was valued at nearly $80,000, but would not say how a hacker could profit by stealing this data, other than by selling the information to others. Riggs, if convicted on all charges, could be sentenced to 32 years in prison and fined $222,000. Neidorf could be sentenced to 31 years and fined $122,000 on conviction. Riggs and Neidorf are charged with interstate transportation of stolen property, wire fraud and violations of the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act of 1986. AP-NR-02-07-90 0549EST< 130/132: Utter Bullshit Name: The Prophet #104 Date: Wed Feb 07 17:26:26 1990 Can you believe the above bullshit? Dearly Beloved, Gone but Not Forgotten: Phiber Optik Thomas Covenant Supernigger (gone, unloved, and forgotten) At the arraignment today, one of the Secret Service agents told me, "Everybody is narcing on everybody." Something D.J. said once: keep your friends close, and your enemies closer. -TP 131/132: fuck Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Feb 07 18:44:45 1990 Rob, I cannot believe that bullshit. Good luck... Sigh. People, I don't know how much longer I'm going to keep this up. I mean, they seem to be going after people indiscriminately. Nailing Craig for publishing something in Phrack? That's bullshit. Utter and complete. Even assuming that the info was copyrighted or stolen (which I don't believe), how the *FUCK* was he supposed to know it? I don't even know what issue of Phrack it's in. Am I liable for it because it's up in my file section? If so, what about the thousands of people around the world that have copies of it. lame lame lame mentor, the paranoid. 132/132: 1000 calls! Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Feb 07 18:55:04 1990 Welp, we managed to get over 1000 calls in less than 1 month! Good job, guys! (Caller #1000 was The Inspectre...) The board went up Jan. 13! me _____________________________________________________________________________ *** {"We The People" Sub-Board} *** < Q-scan We The People... 2 - 26 msgs > 1/26: This sub! > Permanent Message Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Jan 24 19:50:03 1990 This sub is for the discussion of today's society, politics, economics, etc. All views are welcome... Mentor 2/26: Libertarianism Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Jan 24 20:10:11 1990 Y'know, the more I deal with the government, the more seriously I'm inclined to take Libertarianism. Has anyone else here read _Atlas Shrugged_? Ok, how about _Alongside Night_? J. Neil Schulman is now making _Alongside Night_ available on floppy. I'm going to get a copy, and see if he'll license (or whatever) it to me to put up in the Transfer section. Mentor 3/26: io Name: Dtmf #27 Date: Thu Jan 25 03:18:56 1990 I'm sure most of you have probably heard or given this speech(?) at some time or another. It seems to me that many of the hackers problems today stem form disunity. Most hackers tend to be loners, and very intelligent compared to the rest of the "A car a house 2.2 kids and a dog" society. Because of this, we tend to do things alone, or in very small groups. If you think about it, and I mean REALLY think, not just in passing thought, if the hackers had a bit more unity we could accomplish quite a lot more. At the current rate, all (well, most) of todays hackers will have quit or been busted within 10 years. The newer generations are faced with more and more problems in learning how to hack, so the population is rapidly decreasing. What if we were able to put away all the petty bullshit and bickering and really go at this? The more experienced ones of us could teach the new people that show potential, and therefore continiue the society. A unification of the computer underground would more than triple the effectiveness, and allow us to explore more and learn more than if we continiue to go our own way. Just a thought, and not to coherent after 40 hrs no sleep, but I think you will get the idea here... Oh, and one more thing...Its obvious that every day more and more things become computerized...The more control we have over computers, the more comtrol we will have over our lives...After all, Big Brudder isn't my favorite guy.... DTMF 4/26: well... Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Thu Jan 25 12:21:00 1990 Ayn Rand does have a well structured viewpoint that is well worth reading/listening to...I also suggest "The Fountainhead". One addition reason for the individualtiy of most hackers...and in my mind he the most important one is as follows: The fewer number of people that are involved in a certain orginization/society/group..etc...greatly edcreases the likelihood of an information breech. I am not just talking about "group secrets" (although it certainly applies), but rather am appling this TRUTH to the entire H/P community. I usually stand by a few general rules...one of which is "If I do not know you I do not trust you"...with the strong option for "I know you THERFORE I do not trust you". Yeah it would be just peachy if the entire "underground community" could bind together into one big close knit LOYAL happily Cleaver-esque family. Realistically though..this will not happen...nor do I think that I want it to. I for one HAPPEN TO LIKE a certain amount of indivduality in my life. pth 5/26: sex! Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Thu Jan 25 16:57:35 1990 hm...got some attention. I, being a MAJOR Libertarian in my beliefs, although not quite as radical publicly as I'd like to have the nerve to be, relate strongly to the needs people have when dealing with a totally overbearing and somewhat outdated method of government. Unfortunately, being in america, we no longer have minds in power capable of reaching decisions that would mold this country into something worth dieing for. People like that are now held back by the good-ol'-boy system of government. It's not what you know, but who you know, and how much money you have. I am kind of radical in my ideas about what I'd do with an ounce of power, but a lot of the things I feel strongly about are shared by a great number of mainly conservative types. Like cutting defense of Japan, nationalizing the health industry, legalizing drugs, starting a whole wide-range of social programs for everyone from the elderly to the homeless...etc... But, again, this IS America, where the attitude is to kick back and let things happen. We are no longer the new kid with the zest for life...we are the tired old redneck who likes to sit at the gas station drinking a beer and watching kids play while we talk to others like us about the good old days. Bullshit. But, until people like myself who are disgusted with this situation come into a position (or age) to do something about it, or at least let our voices be heard, the disgusting current state of affiars will continue. I just hope that by the time that happens, we all won't have fallen prey to the unbelievable degree of sloth that our leaders have fallen victim to. ->ME 6/26: well, if i said... Name: The Urvile #90 Date: Thu Jan 25 18:11:56 1990 if i really said what i felt, i'd probably go to jail anyway, so hey: kill the stupid people & start over. ayn rand with her little essay on how science and a totalitarian government is pretty fucked up. the only problem with that is that science teaches one to question, while any 'hard' government will attempt to suppres questioning. now all we have to do is wait for a government to come along that really does have faith in its populace, and really encourage the scientific mind. or maybe i'm raving again. it's good to be back, at least for a while. greetings, mentor, bloodaxe, jitter. shame i don't hear from y'all more often. 7/26: stuff Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Fri Jan 26 10:09:34 1990 Tennesee (AP) - (paraphrased) A judge today imposed a $1 (one dollar) fine on anyone convicted of beating a flag-burner. "Well, if they want to beat the heck out of a flag-burner, go to it." This assault charge carries a maximum penalty of 5 years in prison and a $20,000 fine. Jesus. While I personally don't like the idea of burning the flag, I like even less the idea of open-season being declared on flag burners. I wonder what the fine would be for shooting one? $10? Mentor 8/26: no... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Jan 26 16:25:25 1990 for shooting a flag-burner it would be 12.50 (50 cents tax, and $2 compinsation for the burners family) DS 9/26: hmm.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sat Jan 27 07:28:09 1990 the main difference between russia and america is that the russians admit they are monitoring the fuck through peoples lives... 10/26: phoenix Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sat Jan 27 12:11:32 1990 What's the government like in Australia? I have no idea how your system works... Mentor 11/26: Hmm... Name: The Apple Bandit #33 Date: Sun Jan 28 06:11:32 1990 Well always remember these: Dont Steal; The government does not like Competition. How about this: I was once walking down a dense path in an unknown forest, and I came to a fork in the path; I took the path less traveled by; and that has made all the difference! Or: The Last Freedom: The Freedom to Flee.. 12/26: re australian government.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sun Jan 28 14:11:17 1990 theyre pretty cool as long as they stay out of my way! they lack the technology to monitor everyone.. which is pretty good.. and they arent the smartest people in the world.. which is also good... and basically if they start to fuck around with various diferenet laws.. ill move to another country.. still for now australia = good.. no problems with government here! 13/26: COOL Name: Silencer #31 Date: Mon Jan 29 20:13:57 1990 I thought about moving to Ausi land a couplke times....looks nice... what sorta networks you got down there...besides the basics...alot of countries have specialty networks that just operate in that particular country... - Silencer .s 14/26: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Jan 30 07:13:07 1990 our FEW networks seem to be much more advanced than your networks.. but i spose we had something to do with that..! 15/26: Anarchism Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Fri Feb 02 04:02:43 1990 I support the anarchist view. Read "Live Wild or Die" or something from the Earth First! camp (some of their stuff is dogmatic though) or Overthrow (a YIP!ster times publication) or SLINGSHOT or various other underground radical magazines. 16/26: huh????? Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Fri Feb 02 08:06:47 1990 When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro..... (From a famous writters attorney with a Mongolian birthmark...) 17/26: my favorite political non-joke Name: Mr. Slippery #72 Date: Fri Feb 02 23:31:51 1990 I did not create it but I love it ---> How do you know an honest politician, he stay's bought! Given that one California legislature was a little more obvious in selling himself than the others and got convicted will let the others act pius when they (1) must have known what was going on and (2) are more discrete but still sell themselves to special issue groups and vote against what is really needed. 18/26: good book Name: Gordon Meyer #65 Date: Sat Feb 03 09:47:35 1990 Another inspiring book is THE MONKEYWRENCH GANG by Edward Abbey. (a sequel was just published, "Hayduke Lives!" but I haven't read it yet.) Check out this book.... Abbey inspired the founding of the only (in my opinion) environmentalist group worth supporting and working for, Earth First! As Abbey liked to say, "resist much, obey little" 19/26: Earth First! Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Mon Feb 05 03:22:34 1990 Some of EF!'s opinions (at least the ones held by the people such as Dave Foreman - the so-called "founder" of Earth First!) are dogmatic and one-away-from-the-real-issue. For instance, their main idea is that the earths problems are due to the fact that the earth is overpopulated, and that excess population is bad. Dave Foreman, or someone similar, said once "If AIDS did not exist, it would be responsible for the radical environmentalists to create one" which I think is bullshit. They need to look back at the cause of the overpopulation, which, in my opinion is the fact that our whole economic system and social system seems to be based around sex. Of course there are al ot of other factors involved as well. But I would still call myself a member of EF! even though I don't belive in some of their ideas. I agree with them that the earth needs to be protected and that people must learn or pay. But, as far as some of the stuff, "throw a brick through a plate glass window of some corrupt corporation" well, what happens then to the shattered peices of glass? They get picked up, and thrown away, or worse yet, just lay there. Either way, this is contributing to the garbage and waste level. The company will just buy another window, which pumps out more money into the economy, and puts more money in uncle sam's pocket (taxes for instance) which propogates the shit even further. So I think some of the "radical" actions are (at least time-scope wise) just another part of the problem. But there are a lot of variables here too.... I read an article in Live Wild or Die about a "puke-in" held by protesters at a local mall during christmas season. As a protest to consumerism, and shopping in general, several people ate a lot of strange, colored food with various textures. Things like yogurt, yellow jelly donuts, etc. were consumed. Then the group each drank some syrup of icepac (dont know if that is the right spelling) and took their positions in the mall by the Santa setup. Before they puked, someone yelled "Shopping makes me puke" and then puked all over the mall ground in front of everyone. Other members in this group of people held signs sayiing things like "The earth is dying and your shopping" and "shopping makes me puke" while they puked and raised a fuss. However, mall security ended up nabbing one of them, who puked in their office. THey all ended up getting off with nothing though. Kind of an interesting story. PR 20/26: Beautiful! Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Feb 05 17:26:03 1990 Christmas makes ME puke. I wish I could have been involved in that!! Hm...how many more shopping days left? ->ME 21/26: ATI #9 Name: Jedi #67 Date: Mon Feb 05 23:43:00 1990 Does anybody have ATI #9 around? Nobody seems to have it, including GZ, and it's all that's needed to make the collection here complete. 22/26: EF! Name: Gordon Meyer #65 Date: Tue Feb 06 20:13:38 1990 RE: Earth First! Our problem isn't sex per se, it's capitalism and the rape of the earth for profit. The fucking Forest Service sells our national parks behind our backs, Uncle Sam protects the big corporation that our poisoning our water.... oh man..i'm gettting deppressed. It's Equal Rights for all species, and the protection of Mother at all costs..even over and above our own economic, political, social, religious systems. 24/26: They won't listen Name: Cassius Cray #135 Date: Wed Feb 07 06:57:19 1990 The Fed's are happy as long as the Trump's and Forbe's of the world are happy, they don't give a rat's piss about the middle class that's footing the bill. They'll let 10,000 acres of beautiful forest go under axe before letting some rich ass lose a cuple thousand ... Editorial opinion EOL. Cassius Cray 25/26: well.... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Wed Feb 07 09:56:11 1990 then it seems to me that some of this should go in matrix. what do ya think mentor and et al? does it sound like something the rest of the community would enjoy? 26/26: It seems that way... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Wed Feb 07 15:59:49 1990 and it is... The government is run by the upper class for the upper class... as a memeber of the middle class, I speak from experience. Trying to even get a lowly city council member to accept an appointment is a pain in the ass, if not imposible. Doesn't the constitution guarantee some kind of freedom? Daneel Olivaw _____________________________________________________________________________ *** {Basic Telecom Sub-Board} *** < Q-scan Basic Telecom 3 - 77 msgs > 1/77: This Sub > Permanent Message Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sun Jan 07 05:11:59 1990 This subboard is for questions and discussion on the basic working of the phone system - how it works, what's safe, what isn't, etc. If you want to discuss specific phone computers (TIRKS, LMOS, COSMOS, etc.), please take it to subboard #4. Also, beginners shouldn't hesitate to ask questions. There will be someone on here who can answer almost anything you can ask... Mentor 2/77: Basic... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 09 13:52:17 1990 The other day I had the good fortune to type to a fellow hacker on QSD who asked me if I phreaked. I said, not recently, but yeah, I loved boxing. He asked me what "VMBZZZZ" had to do with anything, and proceeded to pester me for codes. This board is for YOU. ->ME 3/77: Welp Name: Acid Phreak #8 Date: Tue Jan 09 17:51:55 1990 If codes are what he wants, then this board SHOULDN'T be for him... --ap 4/77: Blue Boxing...Is it truly gone forever? Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Fri Jan 12 02:57:03 1990 Someone want to find out? I think one of these days we Austinites should get a few tapes made of random calls, and take a case or three on a drive out to the country, and look for places on step, or places with xbar toll offices and goddamn well find us a route to box again. I miss the hell out of boxing. I used to find ALL kinds of great stuff hidden away on the 0XX & 1XX prefixes. I remember one time me and a guy named MOB*RULES were scanning away in 512, roaming the tandems, finding all kinds of strange things that would wink and await further MF...he had some kind of MF DNR on his line though (because of some previous entanglements) and ended up getting a nasty call, saying to stop scanning, because one of the things we were playing with was some kind of GSA owned link from FTS to Bell or vice versa...kinda neat. (At least that's what he said was told to him...he lied a lot) I did find both the Houston and Dallas alliance bridges...when everyone thought there were only White Plains & Los Angeles...YES that was ME. Houston disappeared after 4 months...and Dallas was the chosen site. So what we need is the translate the 0700's and find a route that will allow us to box again, so I don't have to worry about getting my Long Distance bill ever again. ->ME 5/77: boxing under 5ess Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Fri Jan 12 22:55:48 1990 Could someone enlighten me? I have heard everything under the sun about this. Is is or isn't is possible? grey owl 6/77: Boxing... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Sat Jan 13 00:08:53 1990 Of course it is... The problem isn't where you box from, it's where you box to, and the route it travels to get to a final destination. Our problem seems to be that our trunk routing to boxable areas, like 806 go through areas with toll centers having CCISS so it cuts the connection when you lose answer supervision via 2600. That's why I want to find some area that doesn't have this problem... ->ME 7/77: After doing mass research... Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sat Jan 13 03:32:40 1990 Australian phone system sux. OK - does the following... pick up a line and it completes a loop, places you on common equipment. The only way you can send information to the exchage is through thi common equipment shit, and that will only acccept dtmf tones. It then translates your tone, sends them to exchange and the rest you all know. Problem with doing any form of knocking off a trunk is that the second you break out of the CEPT it breaks your loop, and you lose the line. I know all the tones and shit... all i need is a method to actually get the raw tones to the exchange, in orther words, bypass the common equipment. If anyone has any ideas.... Phoenix Jacking out.. 8/77: Fuck it. Name: Frame Error #5 Date: Sat Jan 13 11:54:25 1990 Everything is going digital at an incredible rate. We should find some other method that will allow us to defeat the telco, besides c0dez or boxing. It's going to be rough, I know. FRAME ERROR 9/77: swb Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sat Jan 13 15:23:58 1990 Well, my friendly neighborhood SWB rep just finished playing with my lines for about 2 hours. Someone needs to scan the 512-442-xxxx prefix. 0161 is the test number for their 3M line testers. All of the Austin COSMOSes and LMOSes (that he knows of) are located in San Antonio and Houston. SWB linemen are going to be issued CRAFT terminals in the next 6 months. Regarding the line, the wiring in the apartment may need to be redone. He split my two lines off of the quad they were on, but they're still in the same cable. He's going to find out when/if they can run a second cable. God, I love INLINE service. Makes the $4/month worthwhile... Mentor 10/77: 442-016x Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 13 16:42:45 1990 When you dial the 0161 you get a 1000hz like a loop, but when you dial 0162,3,or 4 you just get a click, like you were connecting to the silent side of the loop. But, the tone on 0161 doesnt stop (perhaps muted?) BS 11/77: Whats happened to the 513 loop? Name: Wiz #25 Date: Sat Jan 13 19:00:04 1990 For quite a while now I have been able to call the USA (I live in South Africa) collect on the high end of a loop. All of a sudden the other night the operator told me that the high end of the 513 loop (513-921-1xxx) was barred from accepting collect calls. This is strange because just one evenening earlier I chatted to the Apple Bandit for about 20 minutes. Has the phone company got wise to the use of loops? Is there a probem with the 513 loop specifically? Any help would be appreciated, as I would be lost without loops. MPE Wiz. 12/77: loops.. Name: Ground Zero #30 Date: Sat Jan 13 22:05:46 1990 I wouldn('t use those 513 loops/. I'm sure they're being monitored, due to the fact that everyone seems to be using them. Use some other loops, guys. I have a bunch/... -gz 13/77: Ground.. Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sat Jan 13 23:19:17 1990 Zero, could you put� up some loops for me? grey owl 14/77: Loops Name: Gary Seven #38 Date: Mon Jan 15 10:47:56 1990 Hello, does anybody have any Michgan loops? Id 313,61,517,906 area codes. If so can ya PLEASE post them. Thanks. Boxing, is it true you can create some sort of hardware called a BOUNCER that somehow tricks ESS into thinking your someplace else. Later 15/77: how do you make a bouncer? Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Jan 15 18:02:50 1990 I don't know much about boxing...especially under ESS5! What's the deal on it? grey owl 16/77: Alliance Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Jan 15 18:18:18 1990 I was on this conference a few months ago. The AT&T people said it was something like November 25th. I don't remember which conference it was, but it was appearantly illegal. (surprised?) The bitch on the other end told me that someone broke in to a business and beige boxed the conference, but not in those words. I was pretty pissed when she told me that they could press charges for the $15 bucks that my part of the conference costed! All I have to say about this is bullshit. There's no way that a 15-20 minute call from me to a conference could cost $15. None of them have been good enough to warrant more than 15-20 minutes. I think AT&T should be shot for 1) charging so damn much to call a friggin' conference and 2) thinking they can charge me for a reverse-billing meet-me. If they do want me to pay, I'll just say I thought it was legal. ("the guy on QSD SAID it was legal...how was I supposed to know?") They won't be able to do anything, right? grey owl (thoroughly pissed off) 17/77: ummmm Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 15 21:33:35 1990 If you didn't do anything but answer your phone, you don't have to worry about it... Mentor 18/77: ... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Mon Jan 15 22:41:51 1990 I never liked AT&T and probably NeverWILL! Tak/Scan 19/77: You'll have to pay Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 15 23:46:15 1990 You called the Meet*Me Noone forced you to call... tough darts buddy. ->w3MEt( w3 ->ME 20/77: AT&T Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Tue Jan 16 06:58:08 1990 Well I haven't read all the messages yet so someone might already have begun to discuss this elsewhere, but here goes... I understand that 3/4 of AT&T National network was down last night. The controlling systems (N something or another) were ALL down around the county. Rumors were that AT&T shipped itself some bad software, but that's probably a line of shit. They haven't ruled out sabotage or a viruse, etc.... 21/77: minor note.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Jan 16 07:34:47 1990 owl.. correct me i i am wrong... but one thing i would NOT say is that the guy on QSD said.. coz i dunno icalling QSD is the most legal thing in the world.. but never can tell :-) Phoenix 22/77: yeah. Thanx Phoenix Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Tue Jan 16 08:47:34 1990 I wasn't sure if trt:g (or anyone elses username:g is legal!) I'm just pissed that they think I'm responsible if someone else breaks into a business and beige boxes a call. Sheeeeit. grey owl 23/77: AT&T Network Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Tue Jan 16 11:12:01 1990 According to the news, the problem was with the "SS7" software, the network that is responsible for routing calls to their destination. Dan Rather (who even looked like he didnt know what he was talking about) said that when a call would be placed, the network would dump the entire translation and route the call to the recording "All circuits are busy". Aprox 56% (?) of the calls would not go through. The Dictator 24/77: Well Name: Gary Seven #38 Date: Tue Jan 16 18:22:48 1990 I myself found that fucked also. I was wondering why the Itt dialup wasnt working. Along with some otherThis is the Ctrl-D Macro routines wouldnt work 25/77: stuff Name: Silencer #31 Date: Thu Jan 18 05:38:08 1990 Well....luckily for me I was out of town during that great AT&T fuckup...Heheh....anyway: Does anyone have like a list of all the different types of switching systems..what they are capable of. improvements with each new ESS etc etc.....or at least know how I could get hold of this information? Gary Seven....herez some Michigan loops....dunno how many work.,..but some must... -------------------------------AREA CODE: 313---------------------------------- XXX-9996 XXX-9997 XXX= 977, 477, 751, 721, 591, 474, 671, 552, 898, 875, 369, 465, 321, 445, 722, 281, 626, 399, 868, 963, 683, 237, 256, 299, 886, 585, 665, 591, 561, 234, 569, 577, 822, 776, 465, 781, 478, 272, 787, 556, 575, 224, 225, 924, 526, 871, 995, 833, 471, 477, 252, 399, 397, 388, 277, 362, 483, 487, 497, 326, 649, 728, 292, 942, 934, 646, 356, 644, 851, 647 god damn...lots of fucking line noise...~.-a.. sorry|....?>~| those are all in 313...t~ the suffixes are 9996 and 9997....the prefixes are whats listed.....l8r - SILENCER ~~/S 26/77: quick question Name: Guc #97 Date: Sat Jan 27 10:38:10 1990 just how safe is scanning a prefix in seq. order? i recall hearing somewhere that ma bell will investigate if they see you've been doing so. I have non-sequential dailing programs for dos, but the ones i have for my c64 are just sequential (0001,0002,0003) and i'd rather not tie up my XT war dialing... 27/77: seq. scanning Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 27 11:01:34 1990 I do not believe Bell has the capibility to detect this (well, I guess they code if LMOS can store the last #s you called), but dont implement probably for reasons of there thinking that it would take too much time and effort... I dunno... All I can really say is, MANY MANY MANY people have been doing it for years and no problems so far (besides getting caught by some old lady saying your modem was harassing her) Hmm.. If you dont want to tie your XT up war-dialing, then why do it anyway? DS 28/77: Scanner Name: The Genetic Terrorist #107 Date: Sat Jan 27 17:51:08 1990 Does anyone have a random prefix scanner? One that will scan randomly from the lower bound to the upper bounded limits non-sequentially for the IBM? If so, send it up here. |07-|15TGT 29/77: wouldnt be to hard to make... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 27 19:08:55 1990 Do you want to just take every #, scramble 'em and try each in a random order , or just a completely random scanner? DS 30/77: data taps... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 27 19:10:58 1990 what is the best way to place a *STRICTLY DATA* tap on a line? (I guess it could record voice, but I'd like to use it mainly for data) DS 31/77: tape Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sat Jan 27 20:29:11 1990 What baud rate? A good tape recorder will snag 300 & 1200. 2400 I'm not sure about... 32/77: Yea.. Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 27 21:58:07 1990 What would be a good PORTABLE model (By portable i mean easy to conceal) DS 33/77: try a VCR Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sat Jan 27 23:52:14 1990 If you can spare your stereo VCR, you can monitor 3 lines at once! One line on each of the stereo channels and one on video==3 lines. Of course, there is a simple circuit you can build (I'll u/l it here sometime) that will turn on a microcasette recorder when the line goes off-hook and shit it down when the line goes back on-hook. Great for leaving in those CAD Pedestals...come back every now and then to change the tape! grey owl 34/77: nonononono Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sun Jan 28 00:55:46 1990 You can easily conceal a stereo vcr behind someone's house or business? I'd love to see that! DS 35/77: vcr's Name: Ravage #19 Date: Sun Jan 28 13:52:03 1990 they make those little sony watch man with a vcr that you can hold in your hand. the size is no problem. as for recording check out the simpti (dont remember the exact spelling sorry) digital converters for recording audio on video tape. very good resolution. they should handle everything you could want to do. they are about the size of a 3 ring notebook. and if you use a wired remote type i/o to the recorder then you could use a vox. 36/77: but Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sun Jan 28 14:13:30 1990 whod want to buy a tiny sony vcr for x millions of dollars ? and then leave it behind someones office, running the risk of never seeing it again ? well - id just jump at the chance todo something like that ;-) phoenix 37/77: 2 thing Name: Guc #97 Date: Sun Jan 28 17:02:01 1990 re: wardialing first off, i seriously doubt anyone will complain about someone harassing them when someone is wardialing. you only call each number one time, and how often do you call ma bell when someone calls and doesnt say anything just once? secondly, i just said fuck it and started from scratch on a non-sequential wardialer for my 64, i just need to come up with a decent algorythem that will eventually do all numbers in a prefix, while not doing the set sequentially. re: datataps i got mine working virtually error free upto 1200 baud. i've not tried 2400 baud yet, but will soon. 300 baud is damn easy and doesnt really require quality equipment, but noone uses 300 anymore, at least noone who has a password i'd give a fuck about. the vcr idea is a good one, but as Dark Sun pointed out they're rather hard to hide. i can cram my microcassete recorder INSIDE a phonebox. oh, right before the system went down last year, there was a discussion on slowing down tape roters to get more time per side, has anyone had any success doing this? If so, let me know, I'd love to find out how. .s 38/77: one more thing Name: Guc #97 Date: Sun Jan 28 17:07:22 1990 has anyone *recently* scanned 794-XXXX? If so, please upload the data, it'd save me a few days work. 39/77: no, but Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sun Jan 28 17:25:40 1990 I'm gonna start on 5000 and go up tommorow, then I'll post the results DS 40/77: Well... Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 28 18:36:18 1990 one guy did manage to leave his VCR in a Telenet place. It was nothing but a room in a mall with lots of X25 machines and cooling equipment and phone lines. The idea is that it's a stolen VCR, hopefully. grey owl 41/77: First of all.... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sun Jan 28 19:55:22 1990 That was a fuckin' text file, and I myself doubt he really did it. DS 42/77: Random Dialing Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Sun Jan 28 22:14:41 1990 All you need is a perfectly random alogorithm, it'll never repeat until it has done all of them once.... alas, it doesn't exist. I see no reason to even bother.... Daneel Olivaw 43/77: hmmm Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 29 00:05:53 1990 Ok, I'd set the algorithm to make a 10,000 byte array and start filling the slots with a random number generator. Once all the slots had been filled (actually, I'd fill about 90% then assign the rest sequentially in leftover blanks), write the thing to a data file and have the hacker use it. Mentor 44/77: DataTaps Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Mon Jan 29 01:23:08 1990 DataTaps are fun to mess with...Whoever said that no one uses 300 baud anymore..Bahahahaha... Most of the small-time companies that connect to TRW, COMPUSERVE, etc...use 300 baud ... At least out here. Ive encountered a lot of 300 bauders. The dictator Not that I would do anything as evil as datatap anybody...nnonono.. 45/77: sony watchmans... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Mon Jan 29 11:17:19 1990 are only a couple of hundred bucks. it seems to me that if one doesnt have the resources to do the job first rate they shouldnt be doing it. this may account for the rash of busts, technological pre-emminance. the feds have a technological edge and are using it. 46/77: random.. Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Mon Jan 29 12:15:30 1990 The problem with simply gerating random numbers is that the seed is likely to generate the same number more than once and some numbers not at all. Ex: a random number generator is told to generate 10000 numbers between the numbers 1 and 10000...it is certainly "possible" that all of those numbers will be the same. Here is a basic algorithm which will allow a non repeating FULL random number scan. NOTE: most of this example will be written in PASCAL with occasional explain nations in C. I will also assume that this is used to scan a certain prefix so the boundaries will be 1 to 10000 (or actually 0 to 9999...to save word space...we must be FRUGAL!) ok..define the following structure: TYPE hackrec = record of hackattmpt : integer end; VAR ^^^ whoops ...ignore that hackarray = array[0..9999] of hackrec; VAR hack : hackarray; ok..now initialize ALL elements "hackattmpt "to the array index..ex: for count = 0 to 9999 do hack[count].hackattmpt = count; when a number is randomly generated it is substituted as the index for the particualr array location..ex: the randomly generated number is in the var rand...hack[rand].hackattmpt would be the reference to the actual number displayed.FD� Every time a number is used ..the field hackattmpt is changerd to hold the number of 9999 (or whatever the last element is); and the filed at index 9999 is changed to the original index + 1. A chck is made to see if a randomly gernated index holds a value of 9999..if it does it will make its new index hack[9999].hackattmpt...and will continue ... its that easy...any questions? pth. 47/77: Okay heres a question Name: Alter Ego #110 Date: Mon Jan 29 16:29:11 1990 y'all were talk about Electric Switching Systems and you refered to them with numbers i.e. #1, #5... whats the difference between the two(besides the number)??? Alter Ego 48/77: phelix Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 29 17:35:41 1990 Hmmm... I thought that was what I suggested doing... nice algorithm, though. me 49/77: difs... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 29 19:05:42 1990 the differences between types of esses are subtle...they have to do with new features, amount of traffic they are capable of handling, etc... One of the fortune 500 scanners runs off of an array 0-9999...it also stores busys etc, so you can retry them... The thing about the vcr tapping telenet/tymnet whatever...was that agent steal's file/idea/whatever? I really think that was just bullshit. Although I could be wrong... And by the way...I'm at 300 baud...but I don't guess anyone would be interested in any of the things I'm into... ->ME 50/77: Hmm... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Mon Jan 29 21:02:41 1990 ESS: Electronic Switching System... my understanding (from a tech at SWB) is that the 7ESS can handle over 40 million simultaneous transmissions (i.e. data or voice or video), and I beleive over 4 million independant phone circuits. Theoretically, one 7ESS could handle central Texas... After I beleive 3ESS, they made a drastic move towards more ISDN support, and the 5ESS is the most popular here in Austin, I think there are 5 of them (not including redundant units, usually 2 per setup) Something that I remeber from working for a legal newspaer locally is showing people how to use their TRW terminals to search our online legal database. Those 300 baud pieces of termal paper fueled shit... but they worked... I remembered (luckily) a few of the accounts, but all are now invalid... oh well.. such are the breaks. Daneel Olivaw 51/77: look into Name: Ravage #19 Date: Mon Jan 29 23:13:46 1990 key hashing algorithms. you may be able to break the big array of numbers down into smaller groups. you could then select the two groups based on two seperate keys, group and member. this would mean that at any one time you would only be hashing one small group of keys. since very few search algorithms are linear but rather logarithmic a simple halving can have quite a bit of effect. just a thought. 52/77: Dialing algorithms... Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Tue Jan 30 02:12:53 1990 Pick a random number, 0 - 9999. Pick another random number 0 - 9. Say the first number is 3849 and the second is 3. We are dialing the 512 exchange so dial... 512-3849 add the 3 to first place of last 4 digits... 512-6849 add the 3 to 2nd place of... 512-6149 add the 3 to 3rd... 512-6179 add the 3 to 4th... 512-6172 follow? if the sum is greater than 9 just subtract 10. Count how many youve dialed, store the last number, position 1-4, and the number 3. and you can start and stop whenever... Also, this is going from left to right. If im not mistaken, you can choose the digits to add to in 24 different ways (4!) so pick another number 1 - 24. This algorithm won't repeat until youve gone through all the numbers. How many different orders are their to dial using this method? Well a bunch... I hope everyone can follow this... if not perhaps Ill write something a bit more formal. -PHz 53/77: Speaking of Name: The Blade #64 Date: Tue Jan 30 13:29:07 1990 Where has Agent Steal been? Havent seen him around for 2 months or so. Blade 54/77: that file Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Tue Jan 30 17:39:47 1990 Whether or not Agent Steals file was shit or not is not the point. The point was that it COULD be done. His plan was (practially) flawless so it is possible that he did do it. Are you confused yet? grey owl 55/77: Slowing tapre recorders Name: The Inspectre #63 Date: Tue Jan 30 23:15:24 1990 Somebody asked about slowing tape recorders a while back.. It's really easy to do on standard portable sized tape recorders, just open the thing up, find the motor (it runs the tape motors via a rubber band over a large wheel), yank off the small wheel on the motor and replace it with a piece of heat-shrink tubing or other soft rubber tube. Then put the drive band back and see what recordings sound like. I've can get about 250 minutes on a C-120 with decent (but not great) sound quality with this method. There's a way to get much longer play times with decent quality recordings, but it requires taking out the drive band system and rebuilding the link with a slower gear drive system, but most recorders are hard to convert easily and usually a VOX is a better investment. The Inspectre /e /d (doesn't this system let you edit a message?) 56/77: motor speed... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Wed Jan 31 12:15:06 1990 can be controlled directly by using a 555 timer to control a 2n2222 transistor in series w/ the motor. by varying the duty cycle you can get a lot of speed control w/o a loss of torque, a problem w/ varying the diameters of the pulleys, except at the very lowest speed. total cost is about $10. ravage back in black 57/77: mentor Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Wed Jan 31 12:42:03 1990 sorry...must have misread your "random" post... pth 58/77: ravage Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 31 14:38:12 1990 That does sound like it would work (coming from you, I'm sure it does) but some people arnot electronically oriented as that (me, for one). It would be easier just to get a VOX or change the size of the drive gears. (or get a crappier motor!) grey owl 59/77: the basic circuit.... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Thu Feb 01 10:46:24 1990 can be found in most electronics texts under motor controller. it only consists of about 8-10 pieces and is a good intro project. 60/77: Tape Recorders... Name: Nemesis #122 Date: Thu Feb 01 23:50:29 1990 Well a _vox is easy, and switching pulleys is easy,{so if you use both of them, you~ could probably get a whole lot out of it... However, if you can put out a little money, Id rely recomend a real to real.. itdoesnt have to be a 8 track or 16 track.. not even a 4 track.. but you can get a lot more tape on one of those things then on the largest cassette... I mean a LOT. 61/77: 7e?? Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Fri Feb 02 04:13:08 1990 Is this 7ESS brand new? I have not been up on the latest technology as far as switching systems go, I have been concentrating on VAX/VMS. The ESS versions I am familiar with are as follows: 1,1A,2,2B,3,4,5. The 5E, along with the Siemens EWSD, NTI's DMS-100F (dms 100 family of switches) are generally setting up the stages for ISDN. The 4E's are set up in toll switch applications in most cases. The 1, 1A,2,2B, and 3 are set up for different areas, they have different traffic capacities, different configurations, links to SPCS's, etc. etc. If you would like, I can post several msgs. about switching systems, just let me know and I'll post a bunch of specs. if you want them. Psychedelic Ranger - Riding the forefront of the psychic revolution!! haha 62/77: Badger Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Fri Feb 02 04:34:10 1990 Is anyone else on here familiar with the BADGER test units? There is a Change Notice on one that sounds very interesting.... 63/77: well.... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Fri Feb 02 13:04:20 1990 put them up already! this is supposed to be a teaching board right? why wait for someone to ask? i know a lot of the folks on here have a lot to learn, including me. 64/77: would you get a little better quality Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Feb 02 14:44:35 1990 if you sped up the tape? Even if you only got 15 mins it might be worth it (for what I'd like it for I wouldnt need omre than about 10 mins a shot anyway) DS 65/77: 7ESS Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Fri Feb 02 22:42:59 1990 It is my understanding (from someone at ATT & SWB) that the 7ESS simlpy offers more capacity. I know that 3M's 7ESS will be picking up several exchanges in Austin (i.e. Bee Caves, Fairfax & Fireside), and that they are reselling it back to SWB. Other than that, I'm not sure of the increased capabilities. Daneel Olivaw 66/77: Tape Name: The Inspectre #63 Date: Sun Feb 04 14:20:58 1990 Speeding up the tape will get you some improvement if you use quality tapes, but you could just go spend $300 on a Nakamichi and get great quality. 67/77: But Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Mon Feb 05 03:26:17 1990 But I cannot post the whole damn manual...it would take several months just to type the thing in! I have other things to do...but Ican provide some info! Hm. wouldnt it be nice if we could sort of "concentrate" all the text in the manual into a very short transmission of data at an extremely high transmission speed that you could "un-concentrate" and then read? sounds nice.... Psychedelic ranger 68/77: A800 Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Mon Feb 05 03:33:36 1990 Anyone on here know how to connect to non-standard routing/system codes without engineering an operator, a toll test board, or boxing the call? I'm talking of other ways... PR 69/77: 7ESS Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Mon Feb 05 11:21:57 1990 Well... 7ESS was introduced in its Beta stage late 1987..as a competor to NT fully digital DMS series..the 7ESS is supposed to be essentially a 5ESS& that is capable of full didgital support right down to the A-D convertors...designed for a upper level CCIS(like 7)...and WITHOUT having to either software/patch or adjunt frame the existing switch...AND in that it is Western Electric..the plant engineers do not have to learn anything terrible different from what they already know. As far as unusual routing/mapping...there are a few interesting WATS lines that allow a dirct map to AT&T's DOM with out having to blow MF..thats right it is all done thruogh a DTMF menu!..pretty handy. pth 70/77: TIRKS Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Feb 05 16:42:11 1990 Psy: could you possibly FAX it?? I'm not sure about what it costs to have something faxed, but I would be willing to pay for some fax charges. What city are you in? grey owl ps-why don't we continue this in e-mail Ranger.. 71/77: ... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Mon Feb 05 23:19:42 1990 Anyone have a DMAT for NPA-619. thankx. The 4th Dimension! 619-745-1xxx. Login PW-SPECTRUM. Newuser PW-Gunship. Tak/Scan 72/77: DAMT? Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Tue Feb 06 03:24:17 1990 Do you mean DAMT maybe? 73/77: WHY? Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Tue Feb 06 11:58:21 1990 DAMT's have to be one of the biggest wastes of time..(right up there with Terradyne Fortel)... /t 74/77: h Name: Dtmf #27 Date: Tue Feb 06 19:48:02 1990 Anyone know anything about an Ericson Switch? I was, uh, well, anyway, I found this thing about an ericson (sp?) switch laying around...Said they were going to put one in here in texas...Along with some REAL serious ISDN shit in a few months...Eek, scares the hel loutta me.... 75/77: 7 Name: Nemesis #122 Date: Wed Feb 07 01:04:42 1990 From what I have heard, ESS7 is suposed to handel A LOT more than ESS5, I dont recall exact numbers, but it was an incredible ammount. I have also heard rumors that ESS7 is what is going to be the "official" type of switch for ISDN, apparently is is already equiped for ISDN, whereas 5 needs to be interfaced somehow. However what all this means on a basic level is nothing realy, other than that you will have a lot more places on the same switch under 7...Nice, so you dont have to find a different test number dial up for a bunch of different areas. I have a list of a bunch of DAMTs in the 619, around here somewhere, I cant find it right now, but Ill leave them for you on your board if you like. They are, however (like Phelix said) quite wortless. 76/77: 7ESS Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Wed Feb 07 16:01:35 1990 Your right, but since my docs to the 5ESS predicted ISDN by 1989.... hehe... I know that where I live, we are due to receive ISDN first in this area, but who really knows when. The 7ESS is manly designed for more raw capability.. what you do with that is what's important. Daneel Olivaw 77/77: austin Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Feb 07 18:45:54 1990 Austin just added two class-type features: distinctive ringing & one other. What is it? Damn, brain damage has set in. Mentor ____________________________________________________________________________ *** {Hacking Sub-Board} *** < Q-scan Basic Hacking 4 - 58 msgs > 1/58: This Sub > Permanent Message Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sun Jan 07 05:13:15 1990 This is the area for basic hacking discussions and questions. If it relates to a specific system, there is probably a subboard dedicated to it; but if you're just interested in how to get started, or what's popular and what isn't, etc., this is the sub. Mentor 2/58: Hmmm Name: Konica #47 Date: Mon Jan 15 16:08:52 1990 Well I don't see a sub for IBM's so here is my question.When you connect to an IBM 3708 you type port password but what do the passwors usually consist of? A First and Last name or does it require numbers or something? 3/58: 3708's Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 15 17:26:35 1990 The company I used to work for had one set up on an 800 that all the agents would call in to get policy information on people. They had all their info for logon set up as a host file on FTTERM... I read the file, and their port password was IMSPROD or something like that...It was relevant to the system... If you have a IBM for some specific company, try system passwords relevant to that company or its function. Obvious information, right? Well, just saying that there isn't any set "DEFAULTS" or anything like that. ->ME 4/58: Well... Name: Konica #47 Date: Tue Jan 16 16:48:14 1990 I guess I should go and buy a book on it. Thats where I will learn to program it. The only thing I hate is that the book can only teach you to program it. Not to hack it. Just like any other mainframe. 5/58: IBM Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Fri Jan 19 15:31:26 1990 RE: Well... IBM. If itt's actually IBM you are trying to get into with FTTERM or any of the other cheazy terminals, good luck. Each account ports three times and then the owner has to chance their password every two weeks. Security has to validate the passwords, and they cannot be words. If you fuckup entering the password, you cannot try again later. The account is turned off until the owner gets realtime sig'd. Oh well. Sic.DAYVM1 6/58: IBM Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Jan 19 17:33:20 1990 RE: IBM well, here in austin (AUSVM1,3,6,8), you get about 5 attempts before the account is turned off for 24 hours, and security doesnt have to validate the passwords. Maybe this is just a site-specific security rule. Personally, I wouldnt mess with ftterm because pcterm's twice as good (with data compression) DS 7/58: Hum.. Name: Warf #81 Date: Sun Jan 21 21:48:14 1990 I have the phone number to my school's mainframe. I just need a good hacking prog. Anyone have one? Call sometime.. Call Now! The Dead Zone 602) 844-0365 SysOp: Warf Sorry about the NO color. It used to have color. Oh well.. hehhe!! <=[Warf]=> 8/58: that # Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Mon Jan 22 15:34:52 1990 was for informational purposes only,right?? :-) DS 9/58: what's this? Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Jan 22 16:47:30 1990 If a system logs me on at 1200 baud with E71, and sends... GLENAYRE 4.1.D TERMINAL and then some miscelaneous commands after the header, what does this look like to you? grey owl 10/58: Well... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 18:24:38 1990 depending upon what the "miscellaneous commands" are, it could be a ton 'O things... post the number and I'll check it out if you want... ->ME 11/58: I found Name: Gary Seven #38 Date: Tue Jan 23 12:28:00 1990 I found a Vmb system owned by Gm motors. Coincidently i found 2 carriers next to each other and close to the Vmb. i think they are PRIMEs from Gm. if anybody wants the numbers i will gladly mail them. Later 12/58: .... Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Tue Jan 23 22:20:43 1990 Yeah, Gary go ahead and send me those primes in mail and I will take a look aT Them. for information purposes- The Fourth DImension BBS 619-745-1xxx Login pw=Spectrum New user pw= GUNSHIP 13/58: things... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 23 22:57:29 1990 I think it's time for your friends at The Legion of Doom to start a new service...(with great help from friends) Decryption service! On any unix or Prime, send the etc/passwd file, or the UAF file to the sysop directory, and you will be mailed back the encrypted passwords...(on UNIX< any pw that the deszip could bust) The Prime UAF must be in binary, so kermit it from the site, and xmodem it here. In return, we will not distribute any information gained from your site, but we will probably look arounnd it anyway...but it will remain between you and us. What do you people think? Bad idea? Good idea? Hell...It is just another attempt by me to piss everyone off. ->ME 14/58: aha..! Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Wed Jan 24 01:30:35 1990 umm...hmmm 15/58: Heck Name: The Parmaster #21 Date: Wed Jan 24 07:48:01 1990 Personally i like it :-) Jason. 16/58: Decryption Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 24 19:10:52 1990 I think it's a great idea. I get a whole shitload of passwd files and some UAF files too. \\\______got! grey owl 17/58: Just a couple of questions... Name: Konica #47 Date: Wed Jan 24 23:41:13 1990 Well since the feds know this is a hacker board whats from stoping them from tracing every incoming call to Pheonix Project and getting all the #'s, then monitoring then for illegal activity? And just say I was calling through my personal calling card.....What would they get as the incomming #? If I had a DNR on my line is there any way I could find out? Sorry about this but I am not as good as most of you (except for the guy that keeps posting codes) and the only way I am going to learn is by trying shit out and asking questions.... Hope this is the right sub for these questions.... 18/58: vv Name: Dtmf #27 Date: Thu Jan 25 03:22:29 1990 RE: Just a couple of questions... To check the DNR the best bet woud be to call bell security, or the SCC 19/58: well.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Thu Jan 25 07:27:43 1990 nothing stops them from tracing.. I dont know how it works there.. but down here all traces are illegal unless they are for drug/murder reasons.. 20/58: Feds... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Thu Jan 25 17:05:35 1990 Absolutely nothing would stop them from collecting all local calls, and/or any longdistance company records of calls coming into this number...in fact, I kind of expect them to at least get all local calls here...hell Austin is all ess...most of them 5's...(I think...maybe 1's) However, I doubt that tapping the data line is worth their while...especially when they can just log on and read everything anyway. And the mail just isn't that spectacular... In any case, all calls here made by legal means are legaal, so don't worry about it. Just because tee nature of this bbs isn't that of your average mainstream bbs, doesn't negate its legality. Information posted here is kept legal. If you are truly worried about it, don't call, and sit home being paranoid. Hell, I'm local...I call direct...and now I do it at 300 baud. Hell, I can almost tell what's being typed at 300 baud while listening to it...forget the data tap! Hehe, although a 300 baud data tap is SO simple to playback completely error free...at 1200 or 2400 you kind of have to get the recording levels just right...but 300 gives you plenty of room for error... ->ME 21/58: ess 1,5 Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Thu Jan 25 20:14:00 1990 hey, whats the diff??? :-) DS 22/58: decryption Name: Silencer #31 Date: Thu Jan 25 23:35:01 1990 hmmm....like...you mean once you have an account...read the user file and then you will deencrypt all the passcodez...sounds good....but what the fuck is kermit... - Silencer 23/58: kermit Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Fri Jan 26 10:11:23 1990 Kermit is a 7-bit transfer protocol that is used to transfer files to/from machines. It is mostly found on mainframes (it's a standard command on VAX, for instance). Kermit has the added advantage of being able to work through an outdial (because it is 7-bit). Mentor 24/58: Kermit Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Fri Jan 26 11:20:10 1990 Kermit is merely another transfer protocol like Sealink, Xmodem, Modem7, Zmodem, et cetera. Its relatively slow, but was thought to be better than Xmodem, due to its capabilties. (Don't remember what they are, I use Zmodem). Sic. 25/58: my kermit Name: Ravage #19 Date: Fri Jan 26 12:24:21 1990 lets me set it at 8 bits also. just another trivial note. 26/58: from what I know... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Jan 26 16:26:55 1990 kermit was originally designed to allow transmission of data across 2 computers running with different parity settings. DS 27/58: and.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sat Jan 27 07:28:45 1990 as a major disadvantage.. it is damn slow! Phoenix 28/58: Well.... Name: Johnny Hicap #45 Date: Sat Jan 27 21:28:18 1990 No one answered that question (forget who posted it) that if he was calling through a calling card is it possible to get the number of the person who called even he was calling through hs calling card? What would they get as the number comming in? Would they get the card? Of course then they would just see who owns it. JH! 29/58: more Kermit BS Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sat Jan 27 23:53:57 1990 Kermit is slower than Xmodem, BTW. The packets are smaller (usually 64 bytes) and the error-checking is shot to hell with any line noise. It's better than ASCII though! grey owl 30/58: packets for kermit Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sun Jan 28 00:56:35 1990 can be something like 2k in the newer unix releases (something like that) DS 31/58: 2k kermit packets Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 28 11:58:24 1990 that'll be the day when Telix supports that! So what if the unix can handle it...you have to have it at both ends. grey owl 32/58: but Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sun Jan 28 14:14:31 1990 ill post c source or zmodem up here, lots better than kermit.. and can be used thru net as wll.. coz it too sends in packets! 33/58: kermit Name: Guc #97 Date: Sun Jan 28 17:03:21 1990 doesnt ms-kermit allow one to set the packet size? .s 34/58: xmodem Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 29 00:06:28 1990 If you need xmodem source, there's a copy of it in FORTRAN for a VAX in library 1. Mentor 35/58: i have... Name: Guc #97 Date: Mon Jan 29 08:37:35 1990 x,y,&zmodem for unix, if anyone wants it uploaded, let me know.. .s 36/58: source Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 29 17:35:58 1990 Do you have the source? If so, please u/l... me 37/58: that old question... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 29 19:08:44 1990 hell, I don't even remember what the specific question was myself... however, on my bills it says: 512-441-0xxx CC Call from NPA-NNX-XXXX (where the call was made from) ->ME 38/58: the one i mentioned Name: Guc #97 Date: Tue Jan 30 09:29:38 1990 does not include the source, but i'll check around on various archive sites and see if i can find anything. 39/58: new development Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Tue Jan 30 17:41:09 1990 What are some common Cosmos passwords? Do any defaults exist? How long are the passwords, typically? grey owl 40/58: Cosmos Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Thu Feb 01 02:37:02 1990 Cosmos is a dirivitive from Unix. Try any Unix default and see if you have any luck. Ive seen a wide variety of logins/passwords from system to system, but this is the case for ANY computer system. Just jump in with both feet and swim toward shore. Make sure you dial "safety" so those "big-bad sharks" dont tear you apart on your way. The Dictator 41/58: hey Name: Alter Ego #110 Date: Fri Feb 02 20:40:46 1990 y'all... a friend of mine has to debate FOR hacking... so we need reasons that support the affirmative... got any ideas... either leave me e-mail or post it here and I'll capture it for them... thanx... Alter Ego 42/58: for hacking Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Fri Feb 02 21:57:38 1990 REAL hackers improve systems that they get into. They might have to read sensative mail, but the eventually find stuff that needs fixing and fix it. Check out Steven Levy's book _Hackers_ to find out about the early hackers and what the hacker ethics are. They will help your friend dispell myths about what and who hackers are. This is a good chance to spread the good word about hacking. grey owl 43/58: _Hackers_ Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Fri Feb 02 22:45:04 1990 I dunno about dispelling myths... my understanding is that he was not in the Inner Circle (as he claimed), or many of the other groups. As for how to argue for hacking... got to have a good definition... that is the best start. I hacker is in it for the challenge of it primarily, and does NOT destroy anything other than that required to cover his path. (Mentor.. you wanna interject a little ethics?) Daneel Olivaw 44/58: i think... Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Feb 02 23:11:59 1990 That anyone who has to debate for reasons to hack really shouldnt anyway... The person must not really want to do it and just thinks he/she does... Any comments on this opinion? DS 45/58: Kermit (some more) Name: Mr. Slippery #72 Date: Fri Feb 02 23:37:12 1990 I believe that there is a mainframe Kermit version but I'm not sure if its VM or MVS. In any event, if you have kermit you can expedite getting things on and off any mainframes you come across. 46/58: Kermit... Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Sat Feb 03 03:13:36 1990 ...is available for several mainframes. I know of a machine running VM as well as a machine running MVS that have Kermit. Also, kermit is quite popular on the VAXen running VMS. I also know of a Sperry 1100 that has kermit. -PHz 47/58: hacking... Name: Alter Ego #110 Date: Sat Feb 03 07:16:58 1990 RE: i think... Well I know that they another person both choose hacking to debate on so the filp a coin as towards which debated for and agaist it... They got for it although against will be a helluva lot easier to do... for their wanting hack, they say the do so I'm gonna pick-up a power supply for my other modem and loan it to them... this way y'all can talk to them directly.... Alter Ego 48/58: hacking... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Feb 05 00:48:18 1990 weird...what a wild debate class you must have... Actually, there is NO arguments to support illegal hacking, just as there are no arguments to support peeping in windows... Hacking is my one true love, but I can't justify it any further than to say it gives me extreme pleasure and is one of the most addictive things I have ever experienced, and now that I've had to almost stop for a while, the withdrawls are terrible. Going and nosing around someone's system may end up in the security on that system being improved, but if you weren't supposed to be there to begin with that need shouldn't have existed. TO paraphrase Richard Stallman, hackers today just play a kind of sick game with administrators...one constantly tries to outwit the other, and although the end product may be better security, the time which should be spent on actual programming and research is wasted in securing the system and playing the mind games with the hacker... Hell, what do I care...I used to run around with my other pervert friends and spy on women through windows in apartment complexes... (hehe, phoenix and I were talking about this today...) It's the same kind of thing...people get their jollies by looking at things they know they shouldn't be looking at... so I'm an electronic voyeur...fucking shoot me... ->ME 49/58: COSMOS Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Mon Feb 05 11:26:19 1990 Well where COSNIX is essentailly a bastardized unix shell..I think that you will have more luck attempting to try accts in the following format: RS0X MF0X LA0X SF0X..etc...where RS is the particular field office that uses the particualr Cosmos in question..and X is a digit 1-9... ptjh 50/58: COSMOS Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Feb 05 16:44:07 1990 I'll be sure to try that. So, San Antonio would be SA then...hmmmm. grey owl 51/58: COSMOS commons Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Tue Feb 06 03:35:52 1990 You could also try department names such as NAC (network admin. center), LAC (loop assignment center), RCMAC (recent change memory admin. cntr), etc., and the ones that phelix mentioned, like RSxx, PAxx, RSxx, RCxx, NAxx, MFxx, FMxx, and possibly COMx but I think those are usually defined to be logonable from certain devices only if I remember right. Or can be defined that way (Message and all that). If you are looking for WC's, you can get them a shitload of places. Just go trashing and you'll be likely to get some CLLI codes (common language location identification) which contain the WC. The breakdown for some CLLI codes is something like this: BSTNMABS61T. I think this is the right number of digits. SO this would be BSTN = BoSToN, MA = Massachusets, BS = Wire Center name, 61T = office designation number. So if you are on the COSMOS that serves this WC (of course COSMOSes dont have to be in the same NPA as the numbers they "serve", for instance the COSMOS systems could be centralized in a major city, corp. HQ or something, or some big MMOC or something...and all the NPA's in that state can then dial in (or have a hardwired terminal in some cases) to the centrzlied cosmoses. This happens, and goes contrary to the outdated file on COSMOS by Lex Luthor and LOD/LOH from 1984. But there is still come (should be some not come) good info in those files. Psychedelic Ranger WC# SIR H TN nxx-xxx/nxx-xxxx/CS 1OF/. _ 52/58: ANI Name: Cassius Cray #135 Date: Tue Feb 06 06:24:59 1990 Are there any good write ups on ANI? And to the guy who said he had DNR's on his line--- can you tell when one is on your line? Is there clicking or does your sound go to shit? Maybe I'm getting to paraniod... Well they do say, "Paranoia is nothing to be scare of." Cassius Cray 53/58: well.. Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Tue Feb 06 12:02:32 1990 Grey Owl:..well not actually ..I think you misunderstood what I meant...RS would be Repair Service...MF..Main Frame..etc...refering to the particular field office in question...NOT the city.. As far as WC's...I have found the the mall queens that are using Cosmos/Work Manager..etc...are more than willing to not only tell you which COSMOS they use..but all of the WC's it services.. pth 54/58: Tapping Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Tue Feb 06 17:34:50 1990 is easy to detect... the line voltage drops, just like when you add an extension. The only problem is that the FBI will usually have your voltage boosted so you'll never know... hehe... they aren't as stupid as they look. Daneel Olivaw 55/58: df Name: Dtmf #2 ______________________________________________________________________________ *** {Phone Co. Computers Sub-Board} *** < Q-scan Phone Company Computers 5 - 46 msgs > 1/46: This Sub > Permanent Message Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sun Jan 07 05:14:56 1990 This is intended for fairly high-level interchange on specific phone company computers and the switching systems. If you want to ask "Are 950s safe?", please use subboard #2. Mentor 2/46: Things... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 09 14:09:54 1990 Recently, people have asked me to do some pretty wild things for them. One in particular, although not terribly wild, was to put up an 800 number for a bbs. Very very simple thing. This is the kind of thing that should be discussed on here. First off, does anyone have access to their local bell computers? If so, say so. I would love to tell you all what to do on these things, but I really don't want to just pass on theory, I'd rather see it put into use. I'm planning quite a dandy COSMOS file sometime, which should make anyone who uses it, "KING" of COSMOS. Another point: The various bell packet networks. You all should know by now about the RBOC's venture into the packet game. SBDN, Pulse-net, Microlink II, et al...in any case, there ARE wonderful things on these systems. Most of you probably know about the "lmosfe" on ML2 that goes to a Dallas LMOS front end. However, I doubt that more than a handful of people on here have ever been on an LMOS (through an IBM or a UNIX based machine). It seems to be quite a topic of conversation anyway. Well, let's keep that topic alive...but for starters, where are you and what telco-systems are you in? ->ME 3/46: LMOS Name: Acid Phreak #8 Date: Tue Jan 09 17:56:23 1990 The most recent LMOS interlude was one in my local area. Got the host processor (an IBM 3270) off Predictor. Overall, a very handy tool to add to your telco 'collectables'. The FE's of course were PDP 11/70s using MLT for reference. Aw thit.. lookit all dem Hicaps. --ap (advanced phreaking) 4/46: Humm... Name: Phase Jitter #3 Date: Wed Jan 10 07:23:31 1990 Cris, Why ANOTHER COSMOS file? Too many allready, and it has to be about the lamest PC computer there is... As to LMOS and LCAMOS(Predictor) they are old news, anybod been playing with CRIS (Customer Record Information SYstem). It seems to be a neet little system, although the info is pulled through SMART. Phase LOD! 5/46: Silly Boy... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Wed Jan 10 14:46:40 1990 COSMOS is pretty cool. When you aren't in the sccs, COSMOS is the next best thing. ENtering in things into RCP...hell, I didn't really even know that until Phiber told me, and sure as shit, the order went through the next day. Also, SIR is fantastic for finding ALL phone company computers. SIR is good for finding pbx lines...SIR is just plain cool. Maybe it's just a database, and nowhere near as interactive as LMOS, and maybe you can't really change or find out personal shit, like you can through CRIS (that is what that's all about right?) but it's terrible easy to get into, to get root, to do all kinds of cool things to lines without having to be on a switch. So nyah nyah nyah... Besides, if you don't want to see "another" COSMOS file, then don't read mine. I've only seen two...Lex's TOTALLY shitty one, and some other lame-ass thing. ->ME 6/46: ICRIS Name: Phiber Optik #6 Date: Wed Jan 10 16:37:27 1990 Not to nitpick, but an LMOS CP is an IBM S370 (3270 is an SNA, used to get to BANCS through LOMS for instance). CRIS, as mentioned, the Customer Record Information System is a dandy little IBM system whose main purpose is to house customer records. There are a small handful of "CRIS" systems, like LCRIS (Local), and ICRIS (Integrated, which should be noted is used by the Residential Service Center). Here in NYNEX, the only way to reach these systems (we obviously aren't hardwired hackers) is through BANCS, a bisync network. BANCS is not direct dialable, but IS available through a 3270 link on the LOMS system, used by LDMC (LAC or FACS, depending where you live). And LOMS IS accessible. A host of systems are also available through FACS (which can be reached through LOMS on BANCS) such as CIMAP, LMOS, SOP, TIRKS, the COSMOS-PREMISE interface, etc. So as you can see, rather than going after any specific system, going after the RIGHT system will pay off greatly (LOMS in this example). Oh, waitta-minnit, those mentioned systems are off of BANCS, sorry. You can reach FACS on BANCS, and access a couple 'o things like some of those mentioned, COSMOS (certain wire centers only), etc. OK, enough rambling. Let's hear someone else's input. Phiber Optik Legion Of Doom! $LOD$ 7/46: Huh? Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Wed Jan 10 17:15:25 1990 I'm confused...that rambling kinda threw me.... lessee...You are saying you can get to these CRIS (LCRIS & ICRIS) from LOMS? Hell, I've got a ton'o'LOMS on the NYNEX packet net... Specifically in the NewEngland side (3110:622) SO: now tell me, oh ye telco gods, how are they intertwined? On the LOMS I have, which are Unix based, (and hung on the network, so you could just enter the nua and drop into shell) I didn't see any applications to conenct to some other system...well, I didn't really look at the ttys either. Is the 3270 connection hooked into the thing as a device? Do you cu to the tty it's on there to connect? What do you do? I'm interested now. ->ME 8/46: 3270 Name: One Assembler #11 Date: Wed Jan 10 17:35:41 1990 hmmm... always thought a 3270 was a terminal (At least, thats what all those little labels that say "3270" and underneath the screwed logo... are you interchanging 3270 with sna? 9/46: Datalink2 Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 10 19:03:45 1990 What is it about getting into LMOS from DL2? How do I tell what areas LMOS I'm into, or can I get to any of them? I call the local Datalink2 dialup and login with lmosfe and then I get lost. I guess I need a good file in learning LMOS...can you help...anyone??? grey owl 10/46: blah blah blah Name: Phiber Optik #6 Date: Thu Jan 11 13:41:31 1990 First of all, that's MicroLink II, not "datalink". And 3270 IS SNA. 3270 is the Synchronous Network Adapter to connect an async terminal to a sync or bisync mainframe... OK... On LOMS, you run the command "3270dsp" which is I believe in /usr/bin. Before doing that, you have to run an environment profile (and also READ it in order to get the BANCS logon and FACS name). I believe the proper one is /loms/profiles/BANCSloms.env, or something similar. Once the 3270dsp is run, you will be connected to BANCS. Enter "%log xxx" where xxx is the logon from the env file. Then, connect to FACS. This is also in the env file. Just type what the variable points to. You will then be on FACS. I think FACS is easy enough to use without an explanation. Now aren't we elyte? Uh, Erik, what were you doing on LOMS if not using BANCS??? Reading "HOT RMA" reports? Hehehe. PHIBER OPTIK! $LOD$ 11/46: I I may... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Thu Jan 11 16:40:01 1990 may a minor correction to Phiber's post: 3270 is underlying protocol on the 3274 terminal multiplexers that all IBM mainframes use (or some other model like a 3276 that does other things nice to). 3270 is aterminal implementation that will only run syncronous (for some assenine reason), and is wide spread. The 3101 is a comparable async implementation of that standard. SNA is System Network Archetecture and was developed and used within IBM. It is influential elsewhere, both in layering and in specific protocols, such as SDLC (the link data prto.) which have influenced CCITT and ISO. BTW, 3270 and SDLC are intertwined, and one usually can be associated with the other. >> Daneel Olivaw 12/46: Daneel... Name: Phiber Optik #6 Date: Fri Jan 12 09:22:03 1990 Thanks for the lesson in something I do for a living. What I was trying to briefly mention without going into techno-details was that it is 3270 that makes it possible for an ASYNC system like LOMS (unix) to connect to an IBM host (BANCS). Without SNA, this isn't possible. 13/46: No problem... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Fri Jan 12 22:33:12 1990 just wanted to make sure nobody was confused (or wasn't confused?).. Daneel 14/46: Confused.. Name: Silencer #31 Date: Sat Jan 13 02:33:40 1990 heheh...anyway...Erik: Will your file contain a CMD list or something? I have heard that once in LMOS you can go to a service dept and tap lines.....like you can monitor or talk.... when you try and do it...it asks you for the number,...then the callback number. it then hangs you up and calls back the number you entered...anbd hooks you into the number you plan to monitor. Loops would be useful in this case for callbacks.. This sounds like a load of fun to me (also a good way to get info and stuff....like....tap some office of a LD carrier that you use most often and get the latest scoop on whats going on). Do you know anything more about this part of LMOS? Sounds cool as fuck to me... - Silencer/DFKN 15/46: LMOS Name: Phase Jitter #3 Date: Sat Jan 13 09:51:55 1990 You can monitor lines via LMOS, but it dosn't hang you up.. You enter the IBM via the hicap (High Capacity Front End Processor) or various UNIX front ends (ex. ARSB). It is possible to get to LMOS from other systems, but that is for later discussion. Once in the IBM you enter a special mask (which I will not mention) and then you enter an Employee code, Printer, Call Back Number, TN You want to verify, and a few other things. Then you type the monitor command. LMOS will respond with "Request In Progress" the number you gave as a callback will ring, you pick up the phone and dial "0". Now the conversation on the busy line is on your call back too.. You can rase or lower the volume using "+" and "-". Phase Jitter Legion uh Doom! 16/46: Bell Atlantic Name: Hotshot #52 Date: Thu Jan 18 10:30:38 1990 Does anyone have any information on Bell Atlantics Strategies Computer? The # is 1-800-468-7546 and can connect at no higher that 12oo... 17/46: I didn't think... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Sun Jan 21 22:29:11 1990 you were supposed to post that.... Daneel Olivaw 18/46: ARG!!! Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 02:45:01 1990 He wasn't...Mr. Warf, if you post another fucking code on this bbs, you will be deleted, and I will personally see to it that you are fucked over pretty hard. Hell, the feds are due here any day now, so maybe you will be named as my fucking accomplice on EVERYTHING... Nah, you're too fucking stupid, they'd never buy it...just don't let it happen again. This bbs has VERY few rules, so you should be able to understand them. Keep the fucking codes to your own "K-rad" bbs. ->ME 19/46: Ok.. Name: Warf #81 Date: Mon Jan 22 07:45:57 1990 Sorry dudes. Well, I didn't know that this bbs is just for ANYONE to log on and have ANYONE read ANY of the messages. You should get some security. Oh well... Hasta and sorry again! <=[Warf]=> 20/46: no Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 22 09:23:39 1990 security is not the problem... you are the problem the board is not designed tohave any security.. it is not called a public access board or nothing.. but then again.. who am i to say anything.. Phoenix 21/46: It was... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Mon Jan 22 22:32:27 1990 also stated in the logon that EVERYBODY (i.e. SS (like the Nazis), CIA, FBI all get access on first logon. Are you to ignorant to read, or just don't give a damn about the rules. Daneel Olivaw 22/46: blah Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Mon Jan 22 23:35:44 1990 no more to be said. 23/46: I Name: Gary Seven #38 Date: Tue Jan 23 12:30:17 1990 Found a Carrier and when it is CNA' CNA it is MBT Michigan Bell Telephone. I wonder what it is. I will try to narrow down the o/s but im not familliar with the telco computers. Cosmos,Lmos,Switches or anything like that. Later 24/46: if you don't mind everyone knowing... Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 24 19:11:52 1990 If you don't care who gets the number you might post it here. I'm sure someone will be able to call it up and identify it for you... grey owl 25/46: can anyone translate Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 28 00:22:26 1990 This is off a work order (from I don't know what) Condensed for space: SAS7200128 SAS720128 E 50BM 40 ABS/ABS/LALA COMPUTERS DD 12/11/89 SMC 12/11/89 FB1/D3/RMVL SMC SMC AUT 001 31/LGGS/811427 /SW P W C36 AUSTTXGRWAC AUSTXFI SEF6RM9 FA01 AUSTTXFI SPE W P AUT 02 AUSTTXFI SPE P AUT [END OF WORK ORDER] Any ideas on what all of this is... i know that the 31/LGGS/811427 tells circuit and feature information, but I have never seen the 'LGGS' codes before... any ideas what this could possibly be? Also, does anyone know how to decode all of the work information, I even have the Bell Line maps if that will help... grey owl 26/46: 911 upgrades Name: The Data Wizard #16 Date: Sun Jan 28 23:50:20 1990 Im am in ess1a and recently heard on the news that the local telephone company is going to charge extra to advance 911 features. Now, I have a question concerning this. Is it possible to upgrade 911 services without upgrading the switch to ess5? I hope yes. It dread to think of me being in 5. oh well.. Later, TDW 27/46: I would think Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Mon Jan 29 01:18:50 1990 I would think Yes, that they could upgrade the 911 to E911 without upgrading the switch. Phoenix is mostly comprised of 1AESS switchs and I just cant see them re-doing that many switches... The Dictator 28/46: That report is from.... Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Mon Jan 29 04:59:38 1990 That work order you posted looks like it is from TIRKS. I assume it is the order for some sort of activity about the circuit...I have a TIRKS manual so I could probably define the terms for you if you wish, let me know. Psychedelic Ranger 29/46: Yes... Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Mon Jan 29 21:04:43 1990 actually if you could write a quick little file for acronyms that would be handy, as I have roughly 1000 work orders for lines in my area, and some are VERY interesting, like PBX outdials (dedicated PBX outs) and WATS lines.. Daneel Olivaw 30/46: there it is again! Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Tue Jan 30 17:44:16 1990 The same concept as pad2pad. If we could get the numbers to the outlines on a PBX, we could intercept all calls made. He he heh..hahaha AHAHAHAHAHAH!!! The mind mereley boggles at the possibilities. Daneel--wanna have a translation party when we get the acronyms? Heh. Psy: Type up those TIRKS terms, p줿 f쟶or. (that's por favor if you don't have IBM graphics characters..) grey owl 31/46: Port Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Thu Feb 01 02:39:01 1990 Theoredically speaking: It has been my experience that Cosmos systems are netting in one form or another. Does any know of a way to port commands from one Cosmos site to another? Could you possibly facilitate the CU command? The Dictator Having trouble 32/46: PBX and AT&T 3B2 Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Thu Feb 01 20:48:19 1990 I have some info on a PBX in my area, mostly circuit numbers... some one care to help me decipher this stuff as im not quite up on this... I have the circuit numbers, which are labled as follows: DOD IDD, DOD SELECTIVE CALL SCREENING, 2 WAY REMOTE, DID WINK START nnn & nnn NXXs, FX CIRCUITS (major LD co.). On the 2 way remote number I get dial tone, through that I can dial any number served by the PBX. But it won't let me dial out once in the PBX. Also, I have some test numbers, 1000 Hz, and another one used for checking static. I posted this in this sig cause the 3B2 which this site uses happens to be on the Internet, which means, line orders could be entered via Telnet. I guess my lack of phreak experience is showing... I tend to stay behind a CRT. Any information would be appreciated. -PHz 33/46: TIRKS Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Fri Feb 02 04:19:35 1990 Shit- I cannot post the whole thing, as the manual is quite thick, and there are so many....it would be better if you would post or mail me with a list of the ones you need the most, then I can give you those rather than make a huge, huge file with all the TIRKS abbreviations. TIRKS printouts are very hard to decipher without a manual! I mean, you can guess at some of them, but after a while they get so specific with things involving special services equipment setups that you get a whole lot of shit thrown in there. I have found many nice things from TIRKS printouts (WORD documents actually, Work Order Records and Details) including dialups to systems, translations to 800 numbers, etc. etc. And if you xlate the PL (private line) feature code included on the WORD, you can learn more about the circuit which can lead you to something you are looking for, perhaps. If anyone has any PL codes they want xlated, I can do this..but other people can too, it is no big deal. 34/46: WORD Name: Signal Raider #78 Date: Fri Feb 02 15:17:55 1990 RE: TIRKS A WORD expert! Great. Maybe you can clear something up for me. A typical PL circuit ID is of the form nnXXXXnnnnnn, such as 27LGGX123456. What is the signifcance of the LGGX in the above? I'm guessing it is related to the class-of-service of the PL (two-wire, four-wire, voice-grade, hi-cap...), but I really don't know how. Can you help? -SR 35/46: WORD Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Mon Feb 05 03:43:48 1990 You are correct in your guess that the LGGX code is related to the class of service of the PL. The different positions mean different things....I don't have my translation of PL codes in front of me (but I will find out what LGGX is and let you know), but I do have some old output from something else that has PL's. Here are a few samples: TP HIDF-0117 ST WK SE CLR ST WK TP HIDF-0234 ST WK CP 7-0123 ST WK PL 7.TLNC.104496..LB ST WK (just including the PL field now) PL 5.OPNC.501.232.4545. ST WK PL 7.OSNZ.99944..LB ST WK PL 3.TTDZ.151434..LB ST WK As if you couldn't tell, these came from a COSMOS system that I have obtained printouts from. The TLNC, OPNC, OSNZ, and TTDZ are the codes you are referring to..I am not sure about COSMOS formatting of PL's since TIRKS carries most of the data on PL circuits, but you can fish some from COSMOS. But these 4 char codes are the same as on the WORD documents. Psychedelic Ranger 36/46: COIN Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Mon Feb 05 03:47:55 1990 Anyone know a way around COIN's detection of red-boxing?? PR 37/46: COIN Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Mon Feb 05 11:29:52 1990 well if the "quality" of your wink is good enough the SCP should never know the difference...read my file in PHUN #4 on TSPS...also ask if you need to know how to obtain a good recording ..for your area..as they have a tendency to differ. pth 38/46: good recording Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Feb 05 16:49:31 1990 I'm not sure where I read this, but you can follow the wire that comes out of the payphone and tap it. Then you put about 50 quarters in it. This is cheap since you will always have enough recording time to call anywhere in the world...you have to think about the long-term: 50 quarters is not that big a price to pay for free calls until you get busted! Does this mean that you can't build an electronic red box that will work in any area in the US? I thought that the tones used in once city would be the same as another. Please correct me if I'm wrong. grey owl 39/46: that wouldn't Name: Alter Ego #110 Date: Mon Feb 05 17:56:31 1990 RE: good recording be to hard... the trick would be getting into the silver coil that holds the wires, but you probably could do that with hack saw... just make sure you don't cut the wires... I also thought the tones were the same no matter where you were... �� 40/46: Just do this Name: Psychedelic Ranger #80 Date: Tue Feb 06 03:39:56 1990 If you need to get a recording of the coins, just dial a silent termination test number and insert quarters while holding a suction cup thingie to the mouthpeice of the phone. We did this and it worked great, clean recording. Other times I have gotten really shitty recordings though and they only partially work, or not at all, and probably are noticeable due to the abnormal call processing. But the other times I was trying to do this, there were other factors involved the changed the recording quality. Then just hit the coin return slot and you get all your $ back..and have your pretty musical recording that you can bring to your music class and play as a representation of such-and-such Milliseconds of such and such and so on. PR 41/46: why not... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Tue Feb 06 11:00:46 1990 call your answering machine and record it that way? 42/46: good recording.. Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Tue Feb 06 12:08:06 1990 Well I have found the best recording comes from a combination of the two above suggestions... Call up a friends house (who knows what the deal is) from a coin station ..AND MAKE SURE THAT THE CALL IS INITAITED WIT HA QUARTER!...then have yuor friend unscrew his mouthpiece (to eliminate any backbround noise) and press a key to signal that he is ready to record (using your handy 1.99 Radio Shack induction/suction mic)...and then start plinking quarters in...hit coin release to get'em back (all but the first quarter that is)... pth 43/46: Sheeeeeit Name: Captain Crook #36 Date: Tue Feb 06 20:38:56 1990 On eproblem with all these recording coin tones. Like Scan Man has said before what happens if you are using new or weak batteries to record and then you put new or weak batteries in to replay? The sound/speed will be off enough that the phone will not accept it. 44/46: Red Boxing... Name: Nemesis #122 Date: Wed Feb 07 01:20:58 1990 Well here are a few of my experiences with redboxing... First, some phones dont let YOU hear the tones.. They usually let the CALLED person hear them (I have never found one that doesnt), so call home, and have your bro record them..you can get a VERY good recording that way.. My main problem with red boxing is that MANY fones in my area MUTE the mouthpiece untill the call goes through! It is VERY stupid because I cant even use my pocket dialer (which is a necessity for all payfone hackers.heheh)..So you almost always end up putting in a quarter..However, yet get it back.. no big deal... there are nice ways to "synthesize" the coin tones, but I have had a lot of problems with those.. I found that the BEST way to do it was to make a small Digitizer with playback..I then digitize it, and just push a button and play back into the mouthpiece.. It works very well, and is VERY small..I could use SMT to make it even smaller. I could even dump the ram, and burn an EPROM and sell it..hey.. now theres an idea..hehehe 45/46: i've always. Name: Guc #97 Date: Wed Feb 07 08:45:46 1990 spliced into the line BEFORE the payphone when red boxing. that way, you bypass the muting in the fone. .s 46/46: Sharper Image Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Wed Feb 07 16:04:24 1990 sells a little digitizer for I think $49, and it stores 45 seconds of whatever. That could be handy, and it is about the size of a pack of cigarettes... when I get the cash, I'll probobaly get one. Daneel Olivaw < Phone Company Computers Q-Scan Done > _____________________________________________________________________________ *** {Telenet (now SprintNet) Sub-Board} *** < Q-scan Telenet 6 - 80 msgs > 1/80: This Sub > Permanent Message Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sun Jan 07 05:15:46 1990 This subboard is specifically for discussion of GTE's packet network Telenet. Of course, since you can get to damn near any network in the world off of it, discussion may stray a bit... Mentor 2/80: Yeeeeeeeeeee Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 09 14:16:49 1990 I've been scanning the fuck out of Telenet. (Want proof? Look in the file section.) It's kind of interesting. Systems seem to live exclusively in the 0-1000 range, and a few others lie scattered through the 50000-70000 range. The systems that hide WAY up there have proven to be QUITE virgin territory. You have NO idea how virgin. I have also come to some kind of conclusion about the ENHANCED NETWORK SERVICES NOT AVAILABLE message... It seems that WAY up there I've found a ton of systems that connect and ask USER ID, and then PASSWORD, and then respond with the identical error message givn when you enter a bad NUI. It's my guess that the "ENHANCED" services are some kind of closed user group application, but one that allows a user to connect from any terminal, rather] than from just one that had been specified, and possibly with an ID not specifically designed for that CUG. Dunno about that last part though, as I don't have any more damn NUI's. Anyone want to check out a load of rejectings? I've got ton's of them. ->ME 3/80: Debug Ports Name: Phiber Optik #6 Date: Thu Jan 11 13:46:34 1990 I am requesting assistance in utilizing a TP3325 (preferrably) debug port. Erik? I need to know how to use it MANUALLY, *NOT* through TDT2 (well gooooolly!) . . Phiber Optik ($LOD$) 4/80: Interesting... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Fri Jan 12 03:08:11 1990 Um...what have you gotten yourself into boy? Lemme guess...you've snagged a debug port on your NYNEX-land PSN and want to grab ASCII, right? Uh, I'm kinda used to menu-drivethings when doing stuff like that. Also, the basic info I've gleened from Telenet Techs on TDT2 applications help for that too, although I guess that won;t help you. What I'd do if I were you is call 1-800-Tel-enet and talk to one of their techs. They'll love to talk to someone about something like that. As a matter of fact, I was just talking to them today about a command I never figured out what it did. (TAPE & DTAPE) He'd never heard of them either, so he had to bring in a bunch of the other techs to discuss it...turns out they are for some archaic use to append a textfile you want to u/l to the end of a message you want to send when in Telemail... (I don't know either...sounded like a dumb command to me too) They will probably even be able to send you some kind of manual or some documentation on your specific needs...They have TONS of things lying around they LOVE to ship all over the world for fun. (I only wish TYMNET was more friendly like that...bastards wouldn't send me a TMCS or PROBE manual...) ->ME 5/80: Ah. Name: Phiber Optik #6 Date: Fri Jan 12 09:27:36 1990 I see. I attempted to order docs for telenet before, and they sent me "pamphlets" on how great telenet was. I suppose I'll try again. I have limited success using TDT2, but not much (like connecting and x25screen'ing). The only real commands I kno of on debug ports are "Lxxxx", where you specify a 16 bit hex base address, and "Rxxxx" where you specify how many bytes from the base address to do a hex dump. Other than that, I PAD-to-PAD to get accounts. PO LOD 6/80: debug Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Fri Jan 12 22:58:04 1990 What's up with debug ports? Erik--can you make a command summary for me on the debug tools? grey owl 7/80: Well... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Fri Jan 12 23:56:16 1990 Not really...I'm far from competent using them... I'm going to try again to order a tdt2 manual next week, and if that falls through, I will forever be stumped...Prime Suspect is the "expert" on the subject and I don't even want to try to explain, on the basis that I might give out shabby information. Hopefully he will call here someday. ->ME 8/80: scnas Name: Silencer #31 Date: Sat Jan 13 02:44:47 1990 fuck...I meant Scans.... umm...I was just scanning on 00-99 of a few area codes... I got a few that I am having trouble identifiing....seem interesting... in 30520, 30522, 30563, 30573 all seem to be indenticle. When I type '?' it says somthing like:"expected HELLO: ,JOB: ,DATA" Or something like that.....souunds intersting,,,,maybe some sort of Credit institution or info beaureu or the likes...I have no idea. Also... 20150 - something called Interet...not internet...interet....weird 20145 - Newsnet....?? anyone know anything about this system? I found a couple others that I'd never seen or heard of before..but these seemed the most interesting.... - SIlencer/DFKN 9/80: ok.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Sat Jan 13 03:35:08 1990 whatever asks for hello job or data is usually a hp series machine. the system prompt is a ":", and the logoncommend is HELLO Phoenix 10/80: ... Name: Frame Error #5 Date: Sat Jan 13 12:01:46 1990 Norm - Seattle Telenet Technician - 206/382-0xxx. If you have something pertinent to ask him, go ahead. Please do not harass the guy. I'm not even sure if the number is good anymore. It should be. FRAME ERROR 11/80: Pad to Pad is lame.. Name: Phase Jitter #3 Date: Sun Jan 14 01:05:33 1990 as ERIC said tdt2 is much better, the output is in HEX, but a simple program converts the data to ascii. Phase LOD/h! 12/80: Pad to Pad Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Sun Jan 14 02:04:20 1990 is fan-fucking-tastic. If you know what the plebes are connecting to, and can emulate it, you have them by their balls. Pad-to-pad is still possible in most areas...It seems that only Telenet has done anything to stop it, thanks to the loose lips of Mr. RNOC & Mr. Lex Luthor. Oh well, no use flogging a dead horse... I have gotten more things from pad-to-pad than I EVER expect to from using tdt2 to monitor ports...but it is kinda useful, and it IS real easy to convert hex to ascii...hell, I think there's even an option to get it to DISPLAY ascii anyway. Just don't try to gleen info from a Russian pad...the feds here will think you're sending secret cyphers to your Russian spy buddies... Right Par? hehe...you fucking traitor! Will the Secret Service ever require more than a 3 week computer literacy course to fulfill the Special Agents assigned to computer crime? I hope so... ->ME 13/80: Only 3 weeks for computer crime in the SS?! Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 14 11:50:58 1990 That's ridiculous! If I owned a mainframe that was a target for hackers, I would be raising hell that the people protecting haven't even had enough training to learn DOS. But since I'm on the other side I'm glad they are so stoopid. grey owl 14/80: . Name: Frame Error #5 Date: Sun Jan 14 12:51:39 1990 Who gives a fuck? The less education they have, the more we will be able to do. Which other networks are still vulnerable to PAD/PAD connections? I'd like to play with them a bit. Oh, are the addresses mnemonics or numerical? 15/80: pad-to-pad Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 14 21:39:56 1990 How does this aid hacking besides making the connection untraceable? I know that you just connect to one pad, then to another, but why is this such a big deal? grey owl 16/80: owl Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 15 01:34:29 1990 Ok, what you do is connect to another person's pad as they attach to the network. When they think they are typing to the network, they are actually typing to you. When they attempt a connect, you consult your directory and give them a prompt appropriate to the system they're trying to connect to - if you don't know what type of system, just give them a login: prompt - as The Leftist always says, people are like sheep! They then type their account name to you. You give them a Password: prompt and they type that. You then give them a "INVALID ENTRY, RETRY" and disconnect. They assume that they typed the pw in wrong and try again. You should have logins for a half-dozen or so systems on hotkeys so that you just hit alt-v for vax (or whatever). Simplest way in the world to snag stuff. Mentor 17/80: and Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 15 02:16:54 1990 I personally love it.. 18/80: tdt2 in 813 Name: The Electron #32 Date: Mon Jan 15 06:42:50 1990 who managed to fuck up the tdt2 prime in 813? dont bother answering...i KNOW who fucked it up...8) 19/80: Stuff Name: Gary Seven #38 Date: Mon Jan 15 11:02:17 1990 Does anybody have a list of Outdials for all areas Global and the like. That would be cool to have handy. Erik did you ever release your Datapac Scan file. Datapac being Canada of course 3020 is the DNIC. later. 20/80: tdt2 Name: Konica #47 Date: Mon Jan 15 16:36:43 1990 Can someone please explaine this in full detail? I am having problems with understanding what you experienced people are talking about. So when you say tdt2 please start from the bottem.... 21/80: tdt2 Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Jan 15 18:06:11 1990 Those are the debug tools for Telenet. tdt2 is all the commands that you use to set up and alter the parameters of a PAD. So with pad-to-pad, I can find some way to get the NUA for the PAD I get when I connect to Telenet, or do I find the one for a certain system? Is this clear as mud? grey owl 22/80: ummm Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 15 21:35:10 1990 When you log on to telenet, (from 512, for instance) it will say 512 014A (or 512 014B, or so on). These are PAD addresses. Mentor 23/80: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Jan 16 07:35:24 1990 I do sympathise with electron.. 24/80: Pad addresses. Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Tue Jan 16 08:48:57 1990 I see, Mentor. That's what I thought. I'll just have to call Pac*it through an outdial sometime and get lots of those addresses |-) Does pad-to-pad still work with Telenet? grey owl 25/80: What is Name: Phase Jitter #3 Date: Tue Jan 16 09:46:03 1990 Pac*it just the other day I found a ton of Pac*it dialups scanning.. 26/80: owl Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Jan 16 17:06:49 1990 Well, there are a few telenet pads around the nation that will still connect, but the general answer is no, you can't do pad-to-pad off of telenet anymore. Mentor 27/80: I tried Name: Gary Seven #38 Date: Tue Jan 16 18:24:53 1990 I tried fooling with the pad-pad method also yesterday on Telenet. Entering like 5173a or something and it just sat there until i sent a break signal as usual. Again anybody have something to connect 3106 NUAS? late +r 28/80: Pac*It + Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 16 19:35:23 1990 Pac*It is GM's packet network...no wonder you found them...scanning Detroit? In any case...don't use them. Maybe their local dialups are still ok, but the 800's are dumping everyone calling location to GM thanks to MCI. Um...Phase: try this on the local ports...find one of 200 or less, then place a call to a Telenet address that RCC's, like a pcp dialer and see if it goes through. The ports used to have some kind of fucked up software that would allow you to connect to RCC addresses without an NUI. (But only on ports 200-something or less) But remember: That's part of what got Doc Cypher nailed, et al. ->ME 29/80: pac*it Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 17 08:49:54 1990 Pac*it is still up and working wonders for me. Of course, I'm using a lightning fast outdial to call the already slow pac*it. (The outdial won't let me do 1+dialing except for 800s) You just have to find a port less than 400. 399 works...(experience) grey owl PS: can I connect to the Telenet pads for pad-to-pad via pac*it? 30/80: telenet pads Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Jan 17 12:20:12 1990 If you're going to play pad-to-pad, the *first* thing you should do is either find a pad other than your local one, or use some X.25 software that has your address disguised. They *will* eventually notice something strange, and you don't want your local port address in the header of every connect. No, you aren't going to be able to connect to a Telenet pad via Pac*It. I don't think there's more than 6 pads in the nation on Telenet that still let you go pad-to-pad. Mentor 31/80: pac*it to Telenet Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 17 16:59:02 1990 Why woulnd't I be able to connect from Pac*it to Telenet? I can connect to the Telenet PCP dialers via Pac*it, so why not the pads? Do you have any X.25 software for an IBM/AT? grey owl 32/80: Telenet Pads... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Wed Jan 17 18:58:21 1990 Telenet pads are access barred from ALL addresses, save a few internal 910 and 909 addresses. That's why you can't pad-to-pad on Telenet anymore. ->ME 33/80: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Thu Jan 18 02:02:01 1990 This is just theory... and it may be the biggest load of shit there is... or possibly even coincidental but.. here goes so ar the only networks which }ipad to pad has ever worked on have been tremendously slow networks. all the aster networks have never had pad to pad working on them. rom experiene i can tell you that the problem has been present on more than one type of software, so although possible, it is unlikely that software was problem. Thereore that leaves us with hardware and its setup. If it means anything, tha is where i believe that pad to pad problem lies, in the hardware/setup o hardware. I assume though, that it would be very easy to patch with software modiications.. Phoenix That f key is still broken Jacking Out.. 34/80: Pud to Pudding Name: The Operator #42 Date: Thu Jan 18 22:32:42 1990 Yeah...It was intentional. Anyway, PtP'ing was a blessing in it's time...These days, it has gotten tougher but if you get (usually) a prime, one IS able to as long as it's out of the 3110 DNIC...Ahh...The days of baggin' them Telenet Security NUI's...Ahhh...I think I've ought to go look through my scrapbook... The Operator 35/80: x.29 Name: Konica #47 Date: Thu Jan 18 23:17:16 1990 On Telenet I was scanning and come across a connection that said the following X.29 Password: And if you entered the wrong password it would disconnect you back to Telenet. I am a begginer on Telenet so I would like to ask a few questions. 1. What is x.29? 2. What might be some common defaults (if any) 3. Is this just a waste of time? 36/80: Hope this helps ... Name: Wiz #25 Date: Sat Jan 20 06:30:59 1990 RE: Stuff I'm sure this is old news by now, but there seems to be a PC-Persuit modem which is totally un-restricted (I frequently dial South African BBS's to disguise my origin using this PCP modem) - the NUA that I type in to get to it is ... 03110202001230X, where X is from 1 to 8, but usually only 1-5 work. MPE Wiz 37/80: outdials Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 21 11:27:33 1990 Daneel Olivaw told me that there are outdials in every city that Telenet has set up for rental. Is this true? This would be *extremely* handy for some hacking that needs to go on local to me. grey owl 38/80: Outdials... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 02:49:38 1990 I don't think that Telenet has THAT many outdials... Official Telenet OD's and PCP outdials are one in the same... However, many companies have outdials placed all over the place...for the most part the are stuck on subaddresses... For instance, I have one in 202 that is on sub-address a, and says illegal address unless you specify that sub address...most of these types of outdials, (and I've found a bunch exactly like it) are ventel types, and you also have to go back to command mode and change to half duplex to use it well. Hell, TYmnet has a million outdials... ->ME 39/80: Internet Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Mon Jan 22 07:02:51 1990 Internet. The image of Cyberspace. That's all that name does for me. Somebody with a lucid view of telecom, please explain exactly, physically, what Internet is, does. [This may sound stupid, but hey]. In the future, when posting, with all the acronym's, why don't we also put in parenthesis what each acronym means. I mean, I know most of them, some I don't, but because this is a place of learning, hence "Phoenix Project", why not educate everyone, right? Hearing a bunch of acronyms is a lot less useful than knowing what they are and mean and recognizing them. If I were to have an Internet Gateway address. Just how would I go about using it? Sic. 40/80: actually.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 22 09:40:02 1990 there are heaps o outdoials on telent.. you just gotta know where to look or them..! Phoenix 41/80: internet Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Mon Jan 22 18:56:07 1990 You've got to be kidding! INTER (as in InterLATA?) NET (as in Network?). Put them togeather and what do you get? (tough one, eh?) Bascially, the Internet is a result of the Defense Advanced Research Project Agency (DARPA) which created ARPA net in the late 60's (I believe it was 1969). This network was used by researchers doing government/military work. Eventually, the idea caught on and it expanded. Onwards came MILNET (Military Network), BITNET, etc. etc. etc...... Put them all togeather and you get InterNET (Ethernet based communications, primarily TCP/IP using high speed T1 links). I know that this is a brief explaination, but I'm really tired. It seems as though someone here called me with a shitload of bad news and I don't think I'll get any rest for a week. But when I do, and if I remember, I'll post a more descriptive article on the Internet. 42/80: dodnet Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Jan 23 01:08:05 1990 ARPAnet is supposed to be phased out in the next year or two - it's bandwidth is pathetic. It'll be replaced with the fiber-optic DODnet. Wheeeee! Mentor 43/80: maybe Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Jan 23 06:51:46 1990 a seperate board or internet ? it could get pretty involved.. well... or rather ull ino on internet read the tcp/ip manual..i got it in red paper back... dont know where it is now.. or d give you specs on it.. Phoenix 44/80: speaking of phiber optic nets... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Tue Jan 23 13:27:55 1990 did you know that with a laser and a good optical sensor you can crack fiber optic security. seems when the laser interacts with the beam in the cable you get interference patterns that look like shadows and bright spots, kinda like a twin split interferometry, that can be detected and decoded. 45/80: DODnet? Name: Phiber Cut #34 Date: Wed Jan 24 04:45:39 1990 Maybe there should be a D00Dnet? 46/80: fiber optic splicing.. Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Wed Jan 24 12:15:05 1990 Wheras you may indeed be able to theoretically do it..splicing into a MUXed FO trunk/feeder not only takes the above mentioned equipment ; but some erios serious splicing equipment, the correct knowledge of what to do with that equipment; and a Digital to Anolog converter (unless YOU happen to have digital ready recvrs)... I think that it is beyond my feeble powers.. pth 47/80: well.... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Wed Jan 24 14:37:35 1990 i have done it in a test situation. most computers have a analog joystick port or paddle port, at least my ammy and my 64 do, that is more than capable of doing it. but the ideal way would be to run it to a tape deck for later decoding. while you do have to cut the outer sheath no splicing is done, this would interrupt the cable and set off security. the sheath incision can be done in a black bag like those used for fiels film changes. total cost besides the laser is a hundred bucks. a lot of the stuff can be gotten surplus so the price can be almost free. 48/80: DODnet Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Wed Jan 24 19:14:45 1990 What are the specs for this one? If it ain't faster than the current Internet it will turn out to be DUDnet... grey owl 49/80: DoD Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Wed Jan 24 20:25:35 1990 Has been around for some time now.... DS 50/80: hmmm. Name: Konica #47 Date: Wed Jan 24 23:51:27 1990 No one seemed to answer my question about X.29 before.... On Telenet I got a NUA that responded with X.29 Password: My questions were... What is X.29? And what would e the likly password that would allow me to access the system, for information purposes of course. 51/80: ll Name: Dtmf #27 Date: Thu Jan 25 03:30:10 1990 Maybe this is common knowledge, but no one evr told me so I figgure I'll pass it on...When you are on altgers, and the 'from'has an address, try connecting to it on telenet..I have found some interesting things that way... By the way, does anyone know the full command set for the Internet servers? With the set pri=g command, and the proper password, you get global privs which let you do some things that arent even listed in the global help screens...ANy ideas? Anyone know what I can do with one of the besides wreak havoc on all the ports(booooorrrring d00d) ? DTMF 52/80: od's Name: Silencer #31 Date: Thu Jan 25 23:44:40 1990 Well... could someone compile a list of all the od's they know of or something to that effect and u/l it....or send it via email to users requesting it. This of course would be purely for informatiopnal purposes..heh.. when you log onto an NUA that asks for a cmd and the only thing it accepts is dialout what is this? I couldnt get the thing to connect either..hmm .s 53/80: Hey... Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Fri Jan 26 08:09:11 1990 Could someone who fully understands debug and such (tdt2) and pad@pad on Tymnet and Telenet please explain it to me, either mail, or, if you can explain it in "information" terms, here. Preferably mail, but I'm sure I'm not the only person in the dark. Sic. 54/80: well... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Fri Jan 26 12:25:37 1990 i would like to learn it as well. maybe we could compile the various notes of individuals and put out an issue devoted to it? maybe even put in some code for differnt machines? 55/80: pad2pad Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 28 00:01:22 1990 From what I know, it's no longer possible (except in VERY few and far between systems anyway) on Telenet and I don't know about Tymnet. Here goes my attempt at describing it... When you call Telenet you type @D^M and get a prompt looking like 512 011B TERMINAL = and you just hit enter for the terminal prompt. Above the TERMINAL = line there is an NUA of your pad. It's not a private pad that accepts reverse charging, but it is a packet-assembler/disassembler. Pad2pad is when you connect to one of these public pads and immitate Telenet. Say a user calls up Telenet in NYC and Telenet decides to put him on the next available pad...BUT you are already connected to it so what he types goes to you. When he types "ID blahblah..." and his password, you give him the proper response. You also have his NUI. When he types "C 51359" you have to look in your handy-dandy scan directory and then find that it's a VAX and give him the right prompts. You now have his login/password. Isn't this fun?? Too bad it doesn't work anymore. Try to apply this concept to other things such as phone interception and stuff like that. THAT'S hacking. grey owl 56/80: Pad 2 Pad, the concept Name: Pain Hertz #84 Date: Sun Jan 28 02:48:48 1990 Actually, I read somewheres, on another board I think. About some guy who applied this to an ATM (Automated Teller Machine ;-) ). Supposedly, got his PC between the ATM and the bank mainframe. Had the PC tell the ATM what it wanted to hear, responses to the customers actions, and had the PC tell the mainframe, waiting for customer. I wasn't there... but sounds quite plausible. -PHz 57/80: it was Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 28 11:59:19 1990 Telenet has secured up pad-2-pad possibilities. They REALLY don't want people doing that anymore. grey owl 58/80: Pad to Pad Name: The Parmaster #21 Date: Sun Jan 28 18:17:02 1990 The most awesome gift god has given to hackers.. Many thanks to the boys that discovered it.. You know who u are! :-) Later, Par Jason 59/80: was I right? Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 28 18:37:03 1990 Is pad to pad totally dead? grey owl 60/80: atm Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 29 02:31:40 1990 I don't believe that will work. From everything I've surmised, data is encrypted inside the ATM and not decrypted until the bank. If someone has direct experience to the contrary, please let me know... Mentor 61/80: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Mon Jan 29 02:52:45 1990 i have direct experience to the contrary.. there was a bank which was continuously dialling its host whenever an atm would be used.. from memory the nua it would call was 8181 or 8184 i cant remember.. i dont know the name of the bank... but what i did as as follows.. pad to pad.. intercept atm connection to host.. capture data.. disconnect from remote atm.. connect to host and send data to it.. the reply was not encrypted.. in raw text ormat.. we then found all sorts of uses for that thing.. :-) and i still dont know the name of the bank 8-) ahh, the good old days... phoenix 62/80: hmmm Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Mon Jan 29 17:37:31 1990 How long ago was this? Android Pope & I found an ATM that had a standard 4-prong phone jack next to it. Just for fun, we checked it out. We couldn't get anything but garbage (we tried many different paritys) - and yes, we did establish that data only flowed when the machine was in use. me 63/80: ... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 29 19:17:26 1990 You can still connect to public pads on several networks around the world. Find out which ones yourself... ATM's...I don't see why they would be encrypted...especially those that are hooked up with dedicated lines to their institution. The ideal ones to mess with are those at remote locations where they only update once a night (usually 12 or 1) and grab everything as it spills out. This intrigues me greatly...never can have too much cash laying around. Neat how we are already talking about data taps too, huh? Can the feds put 2 and 2 together and get 4? Hehe... ->ME 64/80: ATMs Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Tue Jan 30 01:22:02 1990 This should really go on "Electronic Banking", but since we are discussing it here..... The example Grey Owl is refering to was on "America's Most Wanted", or somthing like that...about a guy who worked at a bank, learned the system and whatnot. He went home, and programed a "duplicate" (extensive trojoan, if you will)...on his PC. He then placed his PC between the ATM and the host...When the host would send or request commands, those commands would be intercepted by the PC first...the programmer would then send his OWN commands to the ATM. Etc, etc.. The show did not say whether or not the data was encrypted. It would seem to me, that since this guy worked at the bank, that it wouldnt matter...cus he would know the encryption process anyway... The Dictator 65/80: ok.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Jan 30 07:21:13 1990 well.. this all happened in the setting stages of pad to pad on telenet basically i noticed that a whole lot o ports would continuously try to connect to a certain constant nua. upon intercepting this call.. i recieved no input visible on screen, but noticed my modem RX lights blinking. turn controlchars on,and notice cntrl-e flooding in, constant breaks between each. this was same on any connection made to this nua. what the system was waiting for was a control character as a response to start session, and upon recieving it transmitted data to the host. after several attempts, i managed to figure out pretty much how todo most transactions.. what i did use it for was to sprint various numbers . had i known the name of the bank, and domeone who lived in the area, could have had a lot of fun! actually it may still work.. havent checked it for many a moon.. phoenix 66/80: atm's Name: Ravage #19 Date: Tue Jan 30 10:57:19 1990 well the basic technology is available in any engineering library. the one here at ut has several good books on them. a lot of them are connected by secure dedicated land lines to the banks and s&l's. some of the newer ones use a coding scheme based on the trap door algorithm which was broken by the isreali's. but it takes a big machine a long time. nothing even approaching real time. 67/80: btw: I never saw Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Tue Jan 30 17:48:03 1990 I never saw that episode of America's Most wanted, but that does sound cool. It's scary to think that I have the same mind-set as one of the top-10 criminals in the US. grey owl 68/80: Hey, does Name: Alter Ego #110 Date: Tue Jan 30 19:03:09 1990 anyone have any idea on how to aquire an NUI?? Leave me e-mail... Thanx... Alter Ego 69/80: call Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Jan 30 22:51:02 1990 Call telenet engineering and b.s. them out of it... Mentor 70/80: Saudi Name: The Parmaster #21 Date: Wed Jan 31 14:14:38 1990 Then there is the old Saudi citicorp system i connected to... (same concept as pad to pad) when it got it's little it fed me :-) it fed me good. Every fucking card issued by citicorp to Saudi Arabia.. several different Multi-Bank authorizations reports acutally... with ALL the detailing information. all the damn thing wanted was a control-L and to think... I just did it to clear the fucking screen. Later, The ParMaster 71/80: heh Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Wed Jan 31 16:28:56 1990 There are several systems that respond in a very positive manner to a control-E. Mentor 72/80: par Name: Silencer #31 Date: Wed Jan 31 21:34:55 1990 you ever use at&t calling cards or the like? my grand mother recently recieved a $7500+ phone bill from at&t. seems someone got her calling card....lots of calls to saudi arabia.... i would kill to have her fucking phone bill....god damn..but the bitch wont gimme it. - me2 73/80: Stuff Name: The Dictator #43 Date: Thu Feb 01 02:43:24 1990 Hahaha... Thats funny...AT&T calls to Saudi Arabia...ahem..I mean, my condolences to your Grandmother..heehh Par, Control-L huh? Damn...Kinda nice when live those in those little "extras" huh? hehe.. Grey Owl : If you think about it...the best criminal minds in the country are those guys who write those murder mystery shows. Now THATS some creative stuff. The Dictator 74/80: memories.. Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Thu Feb 01 10:09:02 1990 par.. remember that one which had the 7 digit limit.. ahh.. never even used the damn thing.. Alive!!) Par Jason . 78/80: .. Name: Tak/Scan #44 Date: Mon Feb 05 23:21:29 1990 Well On some system "..." also activates a certain OP system. so try ... or %%% or something like that. but always use ctrl characters when nuth else works that usually activates it. NO SYSTEM is100% Secure! The 4th Dimension! 619-745-1xxx. Login PW-SPECTRUM. Newuser PW-Gunship. 79/80: SDS and Packet/74 Name: Sventek #137 Date: Tue Feb 06 07:32:44 1990 I ran into a SDS gateway type of sytem on TElenet. If anyone have any correspondants to it other than TSS could ya post em. Allso if ya know any other type of info on it post it as well. I also ran into a Packet/74. Ctrl-M a few times and a message concerning port 00 being busy. As well as some other info like MHP 1232 swa etc. If anyone can enlighten me on this system, please do so.... all ears.(eyes). Sventek 80/80: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Feb 06 13:24:06 1990 the thing about people like us is that we never give up just when they thought it was safe to start usingcommon/no passwords again.. that mr "f" has done some major developments in that area 8) phoenix ______________________________________________________________________________ *** {BT Tymnet Packet Net Sub-Board} *** < Q-scan Tymnet 7 - 49 msgs > 1/49: This Sub Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Sun Jan 07 20:44:33 1990 This sub is for the discussion of British Telcom's Tymnet packet network. Mentor 2/49: ... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 09 14:29:25 1990 Hehe...I bet a lot of you didn't know that. Um...things: On many tymnet hosts, you can specify different routings, and different sub-addresses by adding a number after the username. IE: username:200 will connect to the host connected to that username at 200. (if one exists) This is VERY cool on usernames that go into a subnet. For instance, the Veteran's Administration has a subnetwork on Tymnet (Which I should still be heavily entrenched, if anyone knows a few wounded Vietnam vets who need extra money in the Disability check) and you can connect to literally hundreds of different systems by specifying the nubmer after the colon. Waycool, eh? In the case that many of you are familiar with, adding the g and dnic after the username, ala username:g2624, etc... That is telling tymnet to rout the packet connections through whatever gateway needed to complete the call... SO, when you call france through fradec, you get ftcc, when you call germany, you get sf. Neat. Also: the standard for tymnet "Nui's" is a t. followed by a username, incase any of you want to hack away. I'm eventually going to scan ALL usernames from a to 99999999 when I get around to writing the damn program. NUA scans of Tymnet have been done, and a ver recent one should be floating around, as Phoenix has just finished it. The problem I have with NUA's is that I can only get to them from Canada! (Or other places) Which is a bitch, since I need to figure out a way to do it from Tymnet. Anyone know an nui on tymnet that will allow for connections back into 3106? ->ME 3/49: ok.. ill put my tymnet scan up here Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Thu Jan 11 03:56:52 1990 but its not quite finished yet.. Phoenix /e 4/49: anyone with a Scanner.. Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Thu Jan 11 18:02:33 1990 Right now, I'm just a spare CPU. In other words, I can run a scanner for you to help speed up scan. NUA's, Tymnet etc. is ok. grey owl 5/49: tymnet to tymnet Name: The Electron #32 Date: Mon Jan 15 06:30:33 1990 dunno about nui's but the only nuas hosts on tymnet can call on tymnet are 3106 and 31069 as far as i can tell.... and i guess nui's would be the same...btw tymnet is one of the few nets that doesnt send the calling address to the remote host (lets the pad software do it) so u could probably patch stuff like psipad.exe to send a fake calling address.... nice for hacking govt stuff i guess 6/49: Tymnet Name: Gary Seven #38 Date: Mon Jan 15 11:06:32 1990 You have a way to reach 3106 DNIC's Erik. Hmm if ya could relay that information to me someway via mail or post it. I have a NICE outdial from Tymnet 300/1200/2400 + they convert. Say you call at 2400 and want to call a 300 baud system they convert the baud rates. If its still up that OD is NICE it calls everywhere in the U.S i know not sure about GLOBAL possibility's 7/49: Well.... Name: Konica #47 Date: Mon Jan 15 16:43:29 1990 Instead of doing a :g2080 I made a mistake and did a ; instead. Now after I did that what was it I might have gotten? I ot something that promted me with a bunch of things. 8/49: Tymnet... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 15 17:30:00 1990 You can reach 3106 addresses from Datapac... You can also do it from most overseas networks, and you can do it from Telenet, provided you have an NUI. Notice, if you do 031069 it says not responding, but try it with an NUI. Real big drag. It works. Telenet error messages are terrible. ->ME 9/49: How do I get to dpac? Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Jan 15 18:08:17 1990 Is there a dialup you can give me? (WATS maybe?!) I wonder if there's an interface like there is for Autonet? grey owl 10/49: DPAC Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 15 23:48:04 1990 In order for you to call 3106 addresses from DPAC, you will have to call up one of the Canadian dialups... I will have to dig around to find the DPAC information computer, so you can get a listing of the damn dialups...there are no WATS numbers for DPAC that you can reach from the USA. ->ME 11/49: and Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Tue Jan 16 07:36:23 1990 when was last time anyone scanned the darn thing... mine is rom beginning 88, 3 digit scan all areas... anyone got better/newer ? phoenix 12/49: dpac info NUA Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Tue Jan 16 08:51:14 1990 There are two of them and I'll just post 'em here: 0302092100086 03020760101901 These have lots of dpac NUAs for thier outdials and some other stuff like that. I can find a direct dialup myself. I was just asking to see if I could save myself the trouble and get a WATS. grey owl 13/49: DPAC Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 16 19:37:46 1990 My DPAC scan was finished last month...it ran from mid Sept. to December. I haven't checked everything out yet, as the files are HUGE and my time is limited. If anyone local wants to help, I'll give them a copy of the printouts and they can check them out with me...(if you want) That way, maybe it will get finished before NEXT September. Hehe ->ME 14/49: hmm Name: Phoenix #17 Date: Thu Jan 18 02:03:48 1990 networks are getting bigger and bigger.. sigh one o these days ill write something which reads nua list and calls them all... just to make sure they all still work. will make updating a hell o a lot quicker.. actually thats really stupid Phoenix 15/49: dpac dialups Name: Silencer #31 Date: Thu Jan 18 06:07:14 1990 Well...I have quite an extensive list of dialups...I'll u/l it in some section of the xfer....herez a few if thats all you need... DATAPAC 3101 PUBLIC DIAL ACCESS NUMBERS Y = ACCESS AVAILABLE N = NO ACCESS AVAILABLE ST CITY MODEM AC PHONE # 300B? 1200B? 2400B? -- ---- ----- -- ------- ----- ------ ------ AB Airdrie 212 403 234-7440 Y Y N AB Banff 212 403 762-5080 Y Y N AB Calgary 212 403 264-9340 Y N N AB Calgary 212 403 290-0213 N Y N AB Calgary 224 403 265-8292 N N Y AB Edmonton 212 403 420-0185 Y N N AB Edmonton 212 403 423-4463 N Y N AB Edmonton 224 403 429-4368 N N Y AB Ft. McMurray 212 403 743-5207 N Y N AB Ft. McMurray 212 403 791-2884 Y N N AB Ft.Saskatchewan 212 403 421-0221 Y N N AB Grand Prairie 224 403 538-2443 N N Y AB Grande Prairie 212 403 539-0100 Y N N AB Grande Prairie 212 403 539-6434 N Y N AB Leduc 212 403 421-0250 Y Y N AB Lethbridge 212 403 327-2004 N Y N AB Lethbridge 212 403 329-8755 Y N N AB Lethbridge 224 403 320-8822 N N Y AB Lloydminster 212 403 875-4769 Y Y N AB Lloydminster 224 403 875-6295 N N Y AB Medicine Hat 212 403 526-6587 Y N N AB Medicine Hat 212 403 529-5521 N Y N AB Medicine Hat 224 403 528-2742 N N Y AB Peace River 212 403 624-1621 Y Y N AB Peace River 224 403 624-8082 N N Y AB Red Deer 212 403 342-2208 N Y N AB Red Deer 212 403 343-7200 Y N N AB Red Deer 224 403 341-4074 N N Y AB Sherwood Park 212 403 421-0268 Y Y N AB St. Albert 212 403 421-0280 Y Y N AB Stoney Plain 212 403 421-0236 Y Y N therez the majority of the dialups for Alberta. Anyone interested in lists of Telenet, Tymnet, Datapac, or LATA dialups...call this info data line. 800-848-4480, Host Name: CPS User ID: 74,74 Password: Network l8r on - SIlencer 16/49: Tymnet Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Fri Jan 19 15:46:53 1990 Does Tymnet have any InterActive chats like Altos or Hamburg? Sic. 17/49: ?? Name: Silencer #31 Date: Fri Jan 19 18:11:52 1990 Altos OR Hamburg? Altos is located in the city Hamburg as far as I know...and does Tymnet have any? Well.. that chat systems QSD and both altos's can be reached from just about any network in the world... on tymnet there are several ways of reaching them. I use trt...btw.. CAn someone tell me what this is exactly? What is Trt? - SIlencer 18/49: trt Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Fri Jan 19 19:17:42 1990 trt is a username. the :g part indicates that you want billing for the following NUA to be sent to the username trt. And valid username will work like that. grey owl 19/49: trt Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Fri Jan 19 19:58:59 1990 Its also an x.25 net (check out the file on dnics in the file section)... I guess when u use trt you're actually using a gateway to trt's facilities (wherever they are) DS 20/49: Well.... Name: Johnny Hicap #45 Date: Fri Jan 19 22:12:14 1990 Try doing trt; and you will get a menu of things.... What is this menu for? 21/49: trt menu Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Fri Jan 19 23:13:44 1990 it's for changing the parms of the gateway if you don't know the Tymnet commands. The only command I know for Tymnet is backspace...turns off echo. trt is a username. The :g;
tells it to bill that call. trt is not the name of a network. grey owl 22/49: nononono Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sat Jan 20 00:14:54 1990 the trt menu is the same as the fradec04 menu... It lets you select which port you want to connect to (ie a pattern testing port)... Selecting port 90 is the same as "c 0311611122222.90"... notice that port 99 is an exit command...makes you wonder... DS 23/49: Please sahre ... Name: Wiz #25 Date: Sat Jan 20 06:36:56 1990 RE: Tymnet I have a NICE outdial from Tymnet 300/1200/2400 + they convert." Gary - please sahre the NUA with us all so that I can use it - the PCP global outdial that I have is only a 1200 BUAD outdial, so a 2400 one would be a dream come true. Thanks. MPE Wiz 24/49: Tymnet outdial Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Sat Jan 20 17:49:16 1990 I've got an outdial service too. Its been working for three years, believe it or not. And just recently moved up to 2400 (thank you). I'll share the NUA, but not publicly. If I lost it, now THAT would suck. Ciao. 25/49: TRT Name: The Parmaster #21 Date: Sun Jan 21 10:12:52 1990 Well aside from all the explanations i've seen so far. (in my opinion) it is the username for the barbados (maybe it was bahametel. don't remember) the username for their test diag s/w i think it's a little option we can take to our advantage (the :g ) It seems to work on any username that connects specifically intl (as far as i've seen) thought maybe it meant "global" and then looked thru the DNIC HOST tables and prompted you for the rest of the address after looking to see if it was actualy in the tables.. there by bypassing the actual address it was supposed to connect you to and allowing you to specify one. But dunno. (not sure about anything anymore the world is fucked up ) but peaceful Later, Par Jason 26/49: what's the best way to scan Tymnet now? Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Sun Jan 21 11:29:39 1990 Since Telenet was shitty enough to ditch the connection between Telenet/Tymnet, scanning Tymnet has been hell for me since I live in the US. What other networks in the states are linked to Tymnet? grey owl 27/49: As was said by someone earlier (maybe on this board) Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Sun Jan 21 20:55:11 1990 the :g tells the username to route the call thru any gateway it needs to to get to its destination (hence, the g). DS 28/49: Telenet/Tymnet Name: Daneel Olivaw #9 Date: Sun Jan 21 22:30:43 1990 According to the techs at Telenet... There is still a gateway between, but it is limited access... Daneel oLivaw /? /h /a 29/49: tymnet Name: Ravage #19 Date: Sun Jan 21 23:51:30 1990 1-800-336-0149 for information. all i do is tell them what city i am in and what the numbers are and they give them to me. far as i know you dont need an account on any of the connected systems to get this info. 30/49: ??? Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Jan 22 02:56:29 1990 What? You are saying that you can call the techs, give them an nua, and they will give you the mnenmonic??? YOu must be talking about something else...god I hope so, I can see them being that dumb... Uh, scanning tymnet, if you won't do it nua-wise through DPAC, try doing all the combinations, but on each 3rd time, type a username that does connect to something so that the error count resets...like old lovable t.fradec02 or something... For you outdial hungry kids...I suggest you get a job and do this: On tymnet, STARLINKINFO it will connect you to starlink's information service so you can find out all you need to use this...It's tons better than pc-persuit, cheaper, and more locations served... not bad ->ME 31/49: xray Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Mon Jan 22 23:50:36 1990 umm...anyone have any notes to compare on xray (hint hint erik?) I have found quite a few VERY interesting "things" (for lack of a better non-descript word), and any additional help on PDP-10 /ISIS would be helpful as it gets real old learnig from online help mans... pth 32/49: ummm Name: The Mentor #1 Date: Tue Jan 23 01:08:41 1990 What do you want to do on the PDP? I'm sure I've got my old manuals someplace... Mentor 33/49: tymnet... Name: Ravage #19 Date: Tue Jan 23 13:31:49 1990 no that will just get you the local number to call for access. the rest is up to you. i read the intro. isis was also used by intel on the intel mdl 800 development system so give them a call and get some manuals on it. we have a bunch of manuals for the pdp 11's, but more are appreciated what will eventually happen in the next year or so is this, we will expand to six phone lines, use novel net to network the 3 pdp's and about 40 other machines with an i-net node and a compuserve feed (it is great being non-profit). this will give us at least 600M disk space, 2 9 trk for offline stores, and two different international feeds out of the network at local cost. 34/49: XRAY Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Tue Jan 23 23:04:18 1990 Arg...I will send you the whole xray manual if you want... There is an option to attach to a node and print ascii dataflow...although I can't get it to work right, (but I haven't dicked with it seriously at all) This is good to learn, as I have XRAY access on a ton of TYMNET subnets! Even a bank or two...hehe. Also, if anyone can get me a TMCS or PROBE or NETVAL manual, or can find somewhere where I can get it online...(I know that trw has tem online somewhere) I would REALLY appreciate it! ->ME 35/49: everyting Name: Phelix The Hack #89 Date: Wed Jan 24 12:22:05 1990 Mentor: ok..on a PDP-10..running RSTS/TOPS...each sub directory is treated as a "user" of the system; regardless of whether or not that is the case. I can list out these directories (FILES/DIR) IF and only IF I know the name of the directory...how can I get a master "root" listing of ALL avaialble directories? As of right now, I have to keep scrounging around until I find a new one (new to me) mentioned in mail or in I/O... EB: yeah..send me everything you have on xray..about the node option are you doing it by ex: loginid:XXX..where xxx is the particualr node in question?...that is the only way that I know of specifing..as far as ASCII..hell, just buffer it in Hex and run it thruogh a connvertor ... pth 36/49: "trt:g" Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Wed Jan 24 13:19:04 1990 As most of you know by now, Barbados is now off the network. And the fradecal systems aren't too hot. They can do some of 2080 (france) and some of Germany (2624). 37/49: they can do almost anything Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Wed Jan 24 16:01:39 1990 the fradec's can do almost anything but telenet by using the :gDNIC parameter DS 38/49: f Name: Dtmf #27 Date: Thu Jan 25 03:31:23 1990 RE: ?? you ask what is trt? Well, trt is dead is what it is..Shit...Anyone know about the username 'dte' on Tymnet? DTMF 39/49: trt Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Thu Jan 25 15:31:37 1990 was up and down irregularly and now it IS gone... use the :g parameter with the 2 other usernames you know (they are common knowledge, but i wont post 'em here due to mentors ``rules'' DS 40/49: two things Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Thu Jan 25 20:39:41 1990 Someone was mentioning things they found on Tymnet. Here's no login's with no passwords: pcinet alascom And of course, some public information is: dpac; 3020xxxxxxxxxx It will do some other DNICs. I have some other stuff, but I'm not too sure where I put it. Sic. 41/49: dpac; 3020xxxxxxxx Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Thu Jan 25 22:03:18 1990 that will only work on non-refused-collect pads...... DS 42/49: hmm Name: Silencer #31 Date: Thu Jan 25 23:49:37 1990 cna is also an acct....needs a pass though.. I find it hard to believe that since trt died ALMOST EVERYONE has stopped calling the chat lines (other than QSD)..god...what a bunch of incometent fools... shit. I'm sure ANYONE can use fucking Pac*it plus...right?!?! .s 43/49: Or. Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Fri Jan 26 08:12:58 1990 Yes, since "trt" died everyone is gone. A lot of those people were "MDA" (some Phreak groupie band in trhe midwest). I was online for two minutes last night, thanks to whoever informed me that the "fradical" accounts could still do it, even if they were barred from DNIC's, by doing the following [in case you missed it]: fradical:gDNIC;password Of course fradical is merely a made up name and has nothing to do with real life, or my dreams. And DNIC is, of course, a number, and password, silly, that's not real either, but it sure would make life easier. Sic. 44/49: Outdial Name: Sicilumm Thorne #28 Date: Fri Jan 26 11:23:47 1990 Curiousity. Can an outdial dialup DNIC's? Like normally, or for instance this is how I call Phoenix Project: please log in: dialout:1306;password ^^^^\ Tymnet Dialout Port (I use 1306 because that way Phoenix is not a long distance call, wah la). Now, if I were to do something like: dialout:g2342;password would that do anything for me. Is there a text file that explains all the Tymnet little keyword/keycharacters? Sic. 45/49: yes Name: Silencer #31 Date: Mon Jan 29 20:30:31 1990 yeah...you can type "information" from tymnet logon...it might be of use... also... the acct:gdnic method wont work for USA dnic's for some reason..i dunno why... it connects THROUGH USA gateways though....hmmm 46/49: :g for USA dnics Name: Dark Sun #11 Date: Tue Jan 30 11:20:25 1990 There is some kinda "regulated" gateway between tymnet/telenet (and may be for the other nets like TRT)... I guess the only way to connect to one of those NUAs is to go thru that specific gateway... DS 47/49: arg... Name: Erik Bloodaxe #2 Date: Mon Feb 05 00:57:33 1990 i was just wondering... has anyone ever been able to get ftcc to do anything? ftcc:gdnic; gives you the ; back like a gateway, but always connects you to FTCC MACS which I was never able to evoke ANYTHING from...real fucking annoying. ->ME 48/49: if anyone's interested.. Name: Grey Owl #10 Date: Mon Feb 05 16:50:24 1990 the usernames 'sched' and 'dbsched' work on Tymnet. I've not gotten passwords yet though. grey owl 49/49: j Name: Dtmf #27 Date: Tue Feb 06 19:54:52 1990 [CThe only thing I have been able to come up with �on the MACS is that if you hit ctrl-e then it will say FTCC MACS again...It almost looks like an editor (Like EMACS) < Tymnet Q-Scan Done > ______________________________________________________________________________ Copyright (C) 1993 LOD Communications. 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